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Archive through April 19, 2002

Sepulchritude Forum » The Absinthe Forum Archive thru June 2002 » Archive Thru April 2002 » Archive Thru April 2002 » TV documentary » Archive through April 19, 2002 « Previous Next »

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Thegreenimp
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:53 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Sort reminds you of one of those old battery powered robots that keeps walking into to a wall, and never stops.
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:43 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Maybe some lube too.
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:42 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

I'd like a little foreplay first.
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:42 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Hey! that hurts.
Wolfgang
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:40 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

*banging head on desk several times*
Dr_Ordinaire
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:33 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Wolfie, do you always have such strong opinions about brews you have never tasted?
Wolfgang
Posted on Friday, April 19, 2002 - 7:19 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

"Statistically, my brew has been liked by Hausgemachters more than by drinkers of commercial absinthe. "

Hausgematchers know how much time and effort is involved. No one wanted to be the jerk to publicly say "your hard work is undrinkable". Hausgematchers also have a tendency to keep their knowledges secret. If they say it's bad, they have to face the usual simple question : "why and what's wrong with it" so they just shut the fuck up.

It's just sad that apparently no one sent him a private email to point him in the right direction. To knowingly let someone *who gave you a drink* fall and then come back to laugh at him is just plain mean.

I have tasted some horrible brews and I'm proud to say that I didn't lie to the makers and gave them at least a little hint.

Guys, does it ever crossed you minds that Dr O. is sometimes acting like a bitter ass because he's drinking A.A. colored absinthe ?


Here's my contribution and I won't say more :

-learn how to reduce bitterness without reducing the quantity of A.A. too much.

-If you wouldn't like a tisane made with your coloring herbs it's because you are using the wrong herbs...
Tlautrec
Posted on Thursday, April 18, 2002 - 10:42 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Perhaps it's a little late for me to be weighing in on this acrimonious topic, but I must confess that I am one (even if I'm the only one among you) who has tried Ordinaire's brew (on two separate occasions, including the now notorious San Francisco gathering last June at Absinthe Restaurant) and found it quite tasty. I can't say that it's as refined or fine as La Bleue, and I am still a Jade virgin, but I did like it. I found it to be cleaner and more natural tasting than any of the Spanish (including Segarra - I'm not crazy about its buttery, woody taste), and to be quite comparable to several other hausgemachts I have been lucky enough to try (including one that was said to be Andy's and another one that was said to be the legendary Nephilim's). If some of you would question my taste because of my testimonial above, well, what can I say? My favorite beer is Westvleteren Belgian Trappist (100 out of 100, I mean it!) I've enjoyed '59s and '61's and '64's of several of the great Pauillacs, and I'm partial to Islay single malt. Ordinaire is a serious craftsman, and I respect his work.
Dr_Ordinaire
Posted on Thursday, April 18, 2002 - 2:25 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

"If you've trained yourself to enjoy wormwood bitterness in your drink, my hat is off to you. But that's a (traditionally speaking) misuse of the plant, because as Don pointed out, the whole idea in absinthe distillation is to *leave the bitterness behind* while extracting other, desirable, qualities of the plant. "

Artemis, Pendell also makes that point in his book ("leaving the bitterness behind"), that's why I have always been curious about why he puts A.A. in the coloring step.

He does say that his recipe "...is based..." in Dick's. Could it be that he replaced A. Pontica with A.A. because the former is so hard to find in the U.S.A.?

One interesting point is that the recipe you translated for Swiss Absinthe of Pontarlier calls for 10g of Pontica per liter, while Pendell recipe calls for only 3g of A.A.

Do you know of anybody who has the original Dick's recipe? It would be very interesting to compare it with Pendell's version.
Timk
Posted on Thursday, April 18, 2002 - 1:59 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Unless of course you want to ; - )
Timk
Posted on Thursday, April 18, 2002 - 1:58 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

"TimK, I know I promised to email you, but a little bird told me what you wanted was those deleted Don posts, and I'm not going to send those to anybody. If you want to talk about something else (I will not discuss Don or Ted or Justin), drop another hint and I'll get back to you. "

Little birdy, tweet tweet,
I was not after those posts for your information (little birdy),

just wanted to erm hmm, err well, it probably falls under the Do not want to discuss it section, but well, there you go, some things you cant just discuss with anybody. Thats how little birdies start tweeting. Anyway, dont worry about it.
Wormwood
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 6:56 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Look up Purl on the internet.

It is/was a cheap homebrewed swill brewed in England in the middle ages. Hop were expensive so wormwood was substituted for hop in this brew.

Shakespere and other who wrote about this stuff didn't have many complements on its flavor. It was cheap horrid tasting and got you drunk.
Artemis
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 2:37 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

"It is in the spirit of fairness that I want to ask you this: if you are going to judge my absinthe based on other people's reviews, I would like you to consider all the reviews, not just Marc's."

I wasn't judging it at all. I agree with you that nobody seemed to have anything bad to say about it until recently, when a lot of people piped up with negative reviews.

What I meant was, IF you're doing what you say you're doing, the negative reviews are almost certain to be accurate. You cannot use A.A. for coloration and get a good result. Other aspects of the coloration process you described are almost as detrimental.

"In beers, I'm a hophead.
So I guess my absinthe reflects that."

So, you like IPAs, something with 40 or 50 IBUs of bitterness? That's an acquired taste. Some brewers try to make the ultimate bitter beer, but boiling hops is only so efficient as a means of extracting bitter principles, so there's a point of diminishing returns - at that point you throw in ANOTHER ounce of hops, but it doesn't do much for you. Probably some people are now using Hop extracts, just as people who aren't satisfied with the hottest peppers go to the extract hot sauces.

I encountered a discussion in a beer newsgroup once, wherein people were speculating on what wormwood would do for beer. I told them, trust me, you might think you like bitter, but wormwood is on a whole nother planet of bitterness than hops. In fact, the second most bitter plant on earth. You AIN'T man enough. This only fired them up further toward concocting the "IPA from Hell".

If you've trained yourself to enjoy wormwood bitterness in your drink, my hat is off to you. But that's a (traditionally speaking) misuse of the plant, because as Don pointed out, the whole idea in absinthe distillation is to *leave the bitterness behind* while extracting other, desirable, qualities of the plant. Now, since coloration is more or less a simple steep, you WILL capture the bitterness. Thus, the use of A.P., which is not nearly as bitter as A.A.

"BTW. The recipe I used originally I found again in the Forum's FAQ. It's one of the two recipes for distilled absinthe, still calling for 3g of A.A. in the coloring stage."

For the reason I just discussed, if you see a recipe calling for A.A. in anything but distillation, you can be pretty sure whoever wrote it didn't know what the hell they were talking about, so everything else they say is probably suspect.

Some of things on parts of this site are simply not accurate, including parts of my own reviews. As so you said, we live and learn ....
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 11:23 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

There can be only one! Bitter man that is...
Chevalier
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 11:21 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

No, Head: Man need not be bitter. Ted Breaux has created a fine version of a classic Swiss man. This man is not bitter; he embodies Spring itself.
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 8:52 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

May the bitter man win.
Dr_Ordinaire
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 8:21 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Artemis:

It was not my intention to insult you, just poke a little fun at your professorial style. I respect your knowledge, and I think you are a fair person.

It is in the spirit of fairness that I want to ask you this: if you are going to judge my absinthe based on other people's reviews, I would like you to consider all the reviews, not just Marc's.

This is what Kallisti wrote about how my brew was received during the Moulin Rouge premier's meeting:

"I had a couple sips around a table of 10 or so people."

"A couple people liked it, some thought it interesting, and some did not like it at all."

This "ratio", if you will, seems par for the course to me. And a far cry from Marc's description. NOBODY would have liked what he described.

For the record, Kallisti was one of the people who DID NOT like it at all.

Statistically, my brew has been liked by Hausgemachters more than by drinkers of commercial absinthe. Nobody is right or wrong, just different.

Personally, I like bitter. I sip my "yerba mate" without sugar. Many people, even in Argentina, find that too bitter. In beers, I'm a hophead.

So I guess my absinthe reflects that.

However, I have learned a lot about this "bitterness" thingy. When I set up my alembic down here, I will probably make two versions, with different degrees of bitterness. (No need to impose my idea of the right bitterness on others.)

BTW. The recipe I used originally I found again in the Forum's FAQ. It's one of the two recipes for distilled absinthe, still calling for 3g of A.A. in the coloring stage. Maybe we should change it...
Aion
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 6:16 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Good to hear that you show the
will to learn.
Maybe that was what you always
meant, but a lot of individuals
here interpreted what you said
totally different.

So finally this is the right spirit!
Everybody has to learn,
nothing will ever be perfect.
Dr_Ordinaire
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 5:03 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Aion, could you please read my posts?

I said that I started making my absinthe in a certain way. (3g A.A.)

Too bitter.

So I changed the coloring. 1.5g A.A., 1.5 damiana. Better.

And I announced that in the future I will change it again. No A.A.

This hardly seems the attitude of someone who's not willing to learn.
Artemis
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 4:07 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

"and to think there are clowns(pierrots-the kind with the pointed hats-white makeup/costume) that find them (absinthe) unbearable and that old friends (run away from? avoid?) me when they see me from afar, saying that i reek(j'empeste) absinthe. if one could say such a thing."

Wow, I really must break out my "reek of absinthe" profile photo and put it back up.

So, I've always thought one of the kinkier absinthe posters was that one with the guy in the clown suit, learing at a mademoiselle near a lamp post. Is there a connection here? What's up with the evil clown connotation? Maurice Chevalier? Jim Morrison (show me - the way - to the next - little - girl) ....
Aion
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 4:05 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Marc,

Don´t be so cruel!
Dr. O wanted to make a very bitter absinthe,
and he has reached his aim 100%.
That doesn´t mean, that he will not be able
to make something totally different, that
would be tastier for your palate.
But there were individuals, who did NOT
tell him that he is on the wrong way
(and you were among them).

But making a failure, knowing that it
was a failure and still telling everybody
this is the one and only truth is the
wrong attidude.
That is what potiticians usually do.

A.
Artemis
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 3:58 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Marc, I'll email you later today.

Aion, I'm not sure - I'll have to check. I owe several people email. Yes, the address you have for me is good. You'll hear from me soon.

TimK, I know I promised to email you, but a little bird told me what you wanted was those deleted Don posts, and I'm not going to send those to anybody. If you want to talk about something else (I will not discuss Don or Ted or Justin), drop another hint and I'll get back to you.
Aion
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 3:52 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Artemis,
is your email address still the same?
sent you an email almost 2 weeks ago
and hoped you would respond.
A.
Marccampbell
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 3:47 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

I have 3/4s of a bottle of ordinaire's horribly ill conceived absinthe. artemis, I'll send you a taste. e-mail me. It really is time to put ordinaire in his place. He's a fucking jive artist
.
Marccampbell
Posted on Wednesday, April 17, 2002 - 3:40 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

trust me, ordinaire's brew is to absinthe what a plastic fuck doll is to sex.

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