|Posted on Sunday, June 9, 2002 - 1:24 pm: |
"Enlightenment cannot be found in books or conversation"
My, how very British of you?
|Posted on Sunday, June 9, 2002 - 11:28 am: |
Enlightenment cannot be found in books or conversation. It can only be found through 'experience'. Books and good conversation can only at best serve as a very badly faded Xerox copy of a very incomplete, badly constructed and confusing roadmap. There is no need to be literate, articulate or intelligent to be 'enlightened'. There's more 'enlightenment' to be found sitting by oneself and fully experiencing the physical sensation of producing a fart than in all the best books, gurus and conversations on this planet.
|Posted on Sunday, June 9, 2002 - 11:07 am: |
Anatomist is one of the very few people I've read anywhere who uses more words than necessary to make a point, and yet makes every word tell. Sort of a strange economy of verbosity. I really enjoy his posts.
I agree with him that the tricksters are overrated - I said previously that the "tricksters" have their place here, but for every time I've been put deservingly in my place by one of them, and for every time there has been a little sartori for me in one of their posts, there have been a hundred simply inane, boring posts. Even the best of them, IMO Head P., has at times a fairly high signal to noise ratio. And the pretenders and Head wannabes publish pretty much pure crap. And I definitely don't need someone waving his dick in my face in every thread.
And unfortunately, you the inane DON'T seem to "know who you are". Or care. And that's the whole problem.
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 5:15 pm: |
kallisti hates booting people, hates it. Its never easy. And I haven't made it any easier by
expanding on the circumstance of robertsmith's banishment. kallisti is perfectly justified in telling someone to leave, whatever her reasons.
She doesn't have to be fair. And she owes no one an explanation. This is her website. We are her guests. We can be disinvited at anytime.
However we got to where we are today, the forum seems to be alive and well. if robertsmith died for our sins, than I thank him for it. I'll build a little altar to him. And surround it with Cure cds, a bottle of Betty's #3, stolen library books,
and nude photos of Drew Barrymore.
kallisti, I love you. Don't let any of this get to
you. You've created a marvelous gathering place.
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 3:43 pm: |
I thought you were speaking more broadly than that.
I don't get much out of the hand waving either... but I find it easy to ignore.
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 3:18 pm: |
"I feel like I am sitting in front of a computer screen."
My work here is done!
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 3:04 pm: |
Sure I've learned things from books and reading. I may have even been sitting in a chair. But in general, it was because the words were a medium for transmitting ideas, or images, or emotional impressions, or whatever. Whereas, the idea being floated here is that peppering everyone else's conversations with inanities is some form of mind-blowing subversive action akin to oracular riddles, and I'm just not buying it. The only idea involved is the same old tired idea: any discourse besides flippant, spontaneous absurdity is uptight and uncool. I thought that was pretty cool when I was 13 and I read about Van Halen trashing any hotel that served green M&Ms. I even thought it was cool when I first studied 20th century art when I was 19, or when I first looked into Zen writings. Now, the idea is getting pretty tired. Having someone try to enlighten me about it with guerilla email posts at this point is like having some smartass wave his hands in your face and make theramin noises when your tripping.
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 2:01 pm: |
If anyone needs to translate French to English, try... Babelfish...
It will translate other languages as well...
Your favorite Stooge...
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 1:03 pm: |
Anatomist, that's pretty reductionist. 'I am sitting in front of a screen, therefore, this experience will only be of a certain value.'
So you don't find any enlightenment in books or good conversation? Or is it just that you have decided not to take this seriously? By which I mean, are you girded in your Noncommital Armor, bearing a Shield of Apathy?
I have read posts here that changed my opinions, opened the world a little wider, made it seem a brighter place. Not all of them by a damn long shot, but jesus, most books don't do that for me anymore either.
That seriousness thing- I think the word poor for this purpose.
What they mean, is getting your ego involved, getting your panties in a bind, having a bad time of it or sticking to a position you know to be wrong out of insecurity. Having your head up your ass.
This is not the same serious you mean, I think. It sounds to me like you mean 'act with gusto, passion, in everything.'
Damn skippy. But it is possible to keep in mind at the same time- everything is not such a big deal.
To not really live out of fear, to be ironic and sarcastic all the time is fucking tragic.
But not to understand, in the end none of it really does matter, that is also tragic.
Happily, you can do both at the same time and avoid such pitfalls.
If you haven't yet, check out the Book of the Subgenius, and in general the Discordian writings. When you get it, it's like a nice, cherry flavored nuclear weapon going off in your skull.
Their method of obfuscation made me develop a mechanism to successfully read it that is very broadly applicable to the rest of my life.
And even if you don't get it, it's funny as hell.
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 6:39 am: |
There's just one little thing I'd like to point out about all this waxing romantic about the posts of pikkle, rs and even head: WE ARE ALL JUST SITTING IN CHAIRS AND LOOKING AT COMPUTER SCREENS! Upon reading the type of post in question, I do not feel like I am being transported and transformed by the liberating power of dadaist tricksterism, enlightened by deeper zen of carefree absurdism, or indulging in some kind of edgy anarchism. I feel like I am sitting in front of a computer screen.
As far as the deeper lessons of not taking 'this shit' or life in general, too seriously, I don't feel I'm in need of such instruction. It's a ridiculous oversimplifed generalization. I've learned plenty about what to take seriously and not at the school of love, death, cancer, and the consumption of absurd amounts of drugs. Not taking something too seriously can be a valuable option, but as a way of life 24/7, it's a vapid, coward's road. Too often these days irony and humor are worn as a noncommital armor to defend against criticism and ridicule. I find that I feel most alive and reap the greatest rewards from life when I risk taking something seriously, making a stand, taking a stake... braving ridicule.
As far as the forum goes, I don't think wanting to talk about something of substance without being interupted by solipsistic irrelevancies is a sign of some kind of deep psychological or spiritual malady. I like to sit outside and enjoy a sandwich without insects getting on it and buzzing around my face, too. I have no illusions about the importance of that particular sandwich to the overall scheme of my life, but since I decided to eat it, I'd like to be able to enjoy it without nettlesome interference. If I want to groove on insects, I'll seek out something more interesting than a common house fly.
|Posted on Saturday, June 8, 2002 - 5:24 am: |
"Perhaps we've come to take all this shit too seriously."
Hmmm? I thought I taught you that lesson.
"he can mesmerize beautiful goth chicks into thinking he's the shit."
Worked fer me.