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Archive through December 12, 2002

Sepulchritude Forum » The Absinthe Forum Archive thru January 2003 » Strictly Absinthe & Collectibles » JABI2 EXXPOSED !!!!!!!????!!!! GENUINE UNOPENED ABSINTHE "PERNOD" BOTTLE" » Archive through December 12, 2002 « Previous Next »

Author Message
Vortex
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 6:36 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Check out my profile pic for a picture of Jabi in his natural environment
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 6:22 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I must concede...
PT Barnum really saw you comin'

It's nice to know for sure, though.
At the expense of others of course.
Traineraz
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 6:13 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Nobody asked my opinion, but I have to agree with Oxy.

You mention not in your first note to Jabi about "this isn't real and I tasted it" but rather in your SECOND that you could tell that the cork had been removed and covered up with dirt. Instead of simply LEAVING it sealed as you found it, knowing as you did that it had been removed previously, you opened it anyway.

Now there's no way for you to prove that YOU didn't remove the cork and replace the $250 contents with Nasty Sebor Strong. Jabi also has no way of knowing this.

There's also a REMOTE possibility that Jabi is just a twit who doesn't know what he's doing . . .
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 4:41 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

He's German ain't he?

Gather up the stakes and pitchforks
and we'll take out that
Fuckin' Castle WolvieStein too!!!!
Louched_Liver
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 4:28 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Or, you could track him down, Vortex, and beat the shit out of him w/the aforementioned purchase.
Zman7
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 4:26 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Vortex,
Or...you could put it up on Ebay as "a genuine fake bottle of Pernod Fils previously sold by the huckster Jabi, etc. etc." Of course I would create a shell Ebay account to do so.....
Vortex
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 3:56 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

margarethamilton6264 is not a real person and ebay is dealing with it as I informed them who it really was. She purchased a video that she bid up to $160 in a bidding frenzy and got pissed off when she realised she could have bought it from me for $20 if she ordered it through my catalog. I would have offered a refund but she was pretty rude about it so I told her I was blocking her email address after getting a few rude messages from her.

Oxygenee, I have been lucky to find real vintage Pernod fills at good prices. Last year I got a sealed liter of Spanish Tarragonna (not sure if I'm spelling it correctly as the (now empty) bottle is in a box somewhere.) That was just over $300. I have also lucked on to other good deals as well. I'm currently expecting a liter and a half liter bottle which cost me $700 total (If I bought this from Betty I would be paying $2800. for the 2 bottles. I've been pretty lucky which is why I don't feel too bad about losing the money on this deal. I once had to pay nearly $500 in customs (this did make me feel bad at the time) fees for 2 bottles of Un Emile due to the way it was declaired by the couriers, (Peter and Ian gave me a couple of freebies to make up for it, (thanks again guys!)) Before I sent the money I was informed that it was fake but I had no way to get out of the transaction. Jabi could have applied for a non paying bidder credit which can get you kicked off ebay. Either way, the bottle was obviously already opened and would look just as it did if I was to cover the hole with dirt. He did not want to open the bottle even after I had paid him because he knew what it was. I was prepared for the fact that it would be a vintage pastis after being informed about it but it wasn't even that. I know it is my fault to some extent (I should have done more research on the bottles before bidding) Thanks to Ted, I now know what to avoid and how to detect the real Pernod absinthe bottles. If I was as sleazy as Jabi I could re-sell the bottle as a vintage pernod, but I'm not (Hmm, perhaps I could sell the green liquid as "authenic green blood given out in the theaters for the Mad Doctor of Blood Island" or "authentic green slime from the movie "the Green Slime"" or "authentic liquified green eggs from the Dr. Seusse collection complete with a certificate of authenticity signed by the ghost of Dr. Seusse :p )
Oxygenee
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 11:48 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

Really, all this sympathy is misplaced here.

Vortex:

If you are sufficiently experienced to have tasted both vintage and Tarragona Pernod, how could you possibly have thought that a sealed bottle of Absinthe Pernod Fils at $250 (around 25% of the going rate for an original sealed unlabelled bottle) could be genuine? As Ted said, if it seems too good to be true, it is.

Secondly, if you had doubts about the bottle, why did you remove the cork, rather than extracting a minute sample with a hypodermic? Regardless of the original rights or wrongs, Jabi is perfectly entitled to refuse a refund now, because by removing the cork you have irreversibly altered the item.

Thirdly, what about margarethamilton6264 allegations (which I notice you do not actually deny in your response to her....)
Celticgent
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 11:23 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

The fun question for Vortex would be:
What exactly did you do to margarethamilton6264 ?
:)
Chevalier
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 8:15 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

I say we hang him out to dry.

my picture

Oh Jabi, you janiform, jowly jobberknowle,
May a just and joyful jehu jugulate and jarble your jumentous jack o'lantern self!
Chevalier
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 8:13 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

What's in that "fountain"? Could it be that Jabi2 actually OPENED one of his precious "antique" absinthe bottles?

my picture
Chevalier
Posted on Thursday, December 12, 2002 - 8:05 am:   Edit PostPrint Post

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=747380980

Vortex ... does the "absinthe" inside this "fountain" look familiar?
Aion
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 10:29 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

> Damn if you sell fake vintage, at least have
> the decency to put some good ...

That would imply that this unsuspecting
individual knows what absinthe was/is and
also a little bit about how it is made.

But all his knowledge seems to be:
> "if the content was green,it must be absinthe"

Ouch! What a pain ...
God, let some brain rain down from heaven!

A.
Vortex
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 9:39 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Jabi's been getting away with this because no one has ever opened the bottles.

this is what Jabi had said about the 2 other fake vintage bottles with the luminous green liquid inside that he's selling:

"it's already sold out, of course, it's too rare.the buyer, an us one has offered it to his son at the 1st birthday, will only open it in
20 years, wow! "

I feel sorry for the kid. Who knows what solvents or other things are in the bottle. I had a sip (yuck)and had the aftertaste in my mouth for the next couple of hours. I think there might acually be SOME absinthe in the concoction but who knows what else.
Wolfgang
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 6:53 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Damn if you sell fake vintage, at least have the decency to put some good hausgemachte in the bottle !

Thanks for sharing your misfortune... sorry for you.
Raschied
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 6:29 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Thanks, Vortex, for letting us learn from your experiences.

May tinea fungus infect the eyeballs and scrotum of that creep named Jabi!
Louched_Liver
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 5:58 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post


Quote:

def




BRILLIANT!!!!
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 4:54 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I think it's a damn shame that folks
can't just be honest with their auctions...

I would'a said something like...

BUY THIS BOTTLE OBTAINED BY
THE FAMOUS AMERICAN POSTER
HEAD_PROSTHESIS!!!! WHO KNOWS
WHAT'S IN IT???? BUT HEAD ACTUALLY
HANDLED THIS ITEM!!!! NEAR VINTAGE,
IT'S BEEN ON HIS SHELF FOR 5 YEARS....

And then of course I would have sent you
a lovely little extra that would have made
you "the envy" of the water cooler.


Please folks, don't be fooled.
ALL CAPS is always a reliable
way to tell the truth from fiction.

TAKE IT FROM ME! HEAD_PROSTHESIS!!!!
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 4:34 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post


Quote:

I bet Vortex could stuff a tubful of dry, spiked ones up there for him.




Def!
Louched_Liver
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 4:04 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Jabi is a real poo-head. I bet he couldn't jam a greased fairy up his ass if he tried.
But, I bet Vortex could stuff a tubful of dry, spiked ones up there for him.
Head_Prosthesis
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 3:04 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

Jabi is def, boiiiiyyyyyyyy!
Petermarc
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 2:00 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

>i know there are many fakes sold in europe as well, but i know where the bottle comes from,it's an auction in paris held every
year by real french absinthe collectors


there is no such auction that i know of, and i've lived in paris for over 3 years...and i know a few real absinthe collectors, too...

>i could threat you for fraud as well, since i never met any collector who drank absinthe of
400$ of value!

pleased to meet you...
obviously, you don't know any of my friends...
Tabreaux
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 1:38 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post


Quote:

JABI:i will def NOT open the bottle, since it's a collector one, sold in a french auction next to paris where i bought this one and some others like "premier,berger,alpes and 2 other pernod", together with other absinthe related items and i paid a high price as well.





For the benefit of anyone who has witnessed Vortex's nightmare....

I believe the other bottles in question are the same ones that I have seen offered around elsewhere recently (and have the same bright green liquid). The ones I have seen from the lot are all fakes. Avoid them like the plague.

The bottle in question is a post-ban pressed glass bottle, which is the first red flag. At best case scenario, it would have been Pernod 40 degree liqueur d'anise...and it wasn't even that.

The second flag is that a seller who really believes that he has what he says he has isn't going to offer it with a $250 'Buy It Now' option. Surely he would be aware that a genuine example is worth far more than that, despite the missing label. If the 'typical people' haven't bid on it, be suspicious.

Thirdly, the bright green liquid is the obvious clincher.

The price and rarity of genuine items has spawned a rash of fakes, none of which have been very clever (fortunately). I know this hurts, but leave your negative feedback and contact Ebay, which is probably all you can do.

Bottom line: If something seems too good to be true, 9.9 times out of ten, it is. Caveat Emptor.
Vortex
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 12:41 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

I'd like to thank everyone who contacted me for help and info.
Vortex
Posted on Wednesday, December 11, 2002 - 12:40 pm:   Edit PostPrint Post

As a few people on the forum previously pointed out someone had recently bid on one of Jabi's 'GENUINE UNOPENED ABSINTHE "PERNOD" BOTTLE." Well that was actually me. I had bid when I noticed that the bottle was different from the one he previosly sold. I would like to thank everyone who warned me about him and his bottle by email. At that point I tried to point out the differences to him about the bottle and back out of the deal without success. Anyway I was curious about what was actually in the bottle. I'm including some excerpts from my emails with Jabi's responce.

ME:I just wanted to ask if you are certain that this is in fact Absinthe.
Somebody emailed me after I bid telling me that he can tell from the bottle
that it is pastis and not absinthe. I'm just asking as I want to make sure
this is genuine vintage pernod absinthe (I love the taste of vintage pernod but hate the taste of their pastis versions)


JABI it's def a vintage pernod, containing absinthe, not pastis.
pernod produced pastis only after the absinthe ban in 1915.
this one is an authentic absinthe one, bought from a french collector
and we tasted an identical one, relocated in the same cellar of an old bistrot
located next to cattenom in france.it doesn't taste bad,but for sure it's absinthe,stronger than the absinthe produced today.

ME I have about 50cl of real vintage pernod fils that I can compare it to in order to authenticate it but I'm hoping that you might be able to taste it and let me know for sure. If it is in fact absinthe that is great but if it is not I would end up returning it to you anyway and it would save the shipping costs to send it back and forth.

JABI:i will def NOT open the bottle, since it's a collector one, sold in a french auction next to paris where i bought this one and some others like "premier,berger,alpes and 2 other pernod", together with other absinthe related items and i paid a high price as well.

if i open the bottle,the value is gone,since the real value of an old bottle is in it's contents and of course the original cork must be intact!
i've sold 2 pernod bottles to two us collectors in the past 2 years and both were confirming the authenticity of teh bottle.
i was collecting absinthe/pastis since more than 20 years and i know the difference.don't know who your expert is,but i'm
trusting french experts as well.
i can only tell you ,since the value of absinthe items is higher in the states than europe,one of my two previous bottles has been
sold for more than 500$ later on.i will ship the bottle "unopened", if you wish to open it,i'll leave it up to you, but a real
collector would never INSIST on such a proposal.
i know there are many fakes sold in europe as well, but i know where the bottle comes from,it's an auction in paris held every
year by real french absinthe collectors and "fakes" would never be tolerated!i never sold fakes on ebay ,where i'm selling for over 4 years.
i will ship the bottle today as promised,i'll leave it up to you to open it or not, of course the real value would be lost,. the bottle will be shipped today,the courrier will show up in around 1 hour as i advised yesterday and in two days you might
judge yourself,but be ensured that's a vintage one!
as advised, bottle is on it's way,should be landing by monday,tuesday morning latest and you will enjoy it.
it's def a vintage one, despite the "saying of your expert" and like vintage wine,it's only worth the money if unopened and of course value will grow year by
year.i have still a vintage pernod,same bottle,dark green glass in my
cellar bar and would never sell it.
i sell to get some money for additional travel, however never sold fakes and
i'm critized by many sellers/antiques merchants, us and french ones, that i would sell items to cheap.well i have a lot of good connections,since i was a
collector for many years and still am able to get absinthe items at reasonable prices, since i'm living in luxembourg next to the french border, it's easier for me to locate some good items, so many old cafes around the border are even elder than 100 years and so many glasses/spoons/holders have been relocated in dark cellars.if you check my "swirl glass" set actually on ebay auction, you would
certainly notice that i put 2 vintage "swirl" glasses and 2 original spoons on auction for 99$ at the "buy it now" option, in general frech or us collectors would sell one single glass at 30-40$ without a spoon.
well have to leave you, i contact you later.

well i have tasted vintage pernod more than 15 years ago, also absinthe,not pastis and was a little bit disappointed about the flavour,maybe it lost the flavour in the past 80 years.was a friend of mine who opened the bottle,would never do it,well
it's an expensive drink for x-mas,isn't it!
at the time being i have still 2 bottles pending, one" premier" and one" alpes" ,bought at same auction.in general it's sold ,i am still waiting for the money, the buyer, an us one,told me to wait till he gets his x-mas check.if he doesn't pay till new year,i'd planned to put it on auction.i will be fair and wait as promised.

ME: (he sent me pictures of the other bottles and they seem to have the same bright green liquid inside)

ME: I wouldn't have minded if you opened the bottle though as that is what I intend to do. The reason I buy vintage absinthe is for the taste and not the value.

ME: Hi Patrick,I got the bottle yesterday opened it today and tasted it. It is definitely NOT absinthe. The liquid in this container is bright green. Vintage Pernod absithe was never this color (it is yellowish-green.) I tasted the contents and it doesn't taste anything like vintage pernod absinthe. This stuff is very sweet as sugar is not supposed to be added to it. It also does NOT louche. I paid for vintage pernod absinthe as is stated in your auction and this is definitely not it. We could have saved the shipping costs if you had tasted it when I asked you. If you purchased this product as absinthe, then your supplier ripped you off. Let me know what the best way to send it back to you.

ME: Just to clarify what I said earlier about louching... the water stays on top and the green liguid stays on the bottom. After about 15 minutes the contents combine but the liguid just absorbes the water. It doesn't turn milky. The liquid in the bottle already has a slightly milky consistancy.

JABI: Don't know what to say.As you could see,it was def a vintage one,and the cork was vintage as well.Of course i didn't taste the contents,since i've bought the bottle at an auction next to paris and paid a very high price myself,my benefit is not so high.
It is still possible that is a special mixture from pernod they used at that time,so we cannot pretend it's a fake.
Since you opened the bottle,i cannot resell it,most of the collectors want an unopened one,since empty bottles are sold
at max 50 dollars.I will recontact some of my french friends who bought at same auction, but still i am sure that the bottle was vintage and the contents genuine,if it was absinthe or absinthe mixture,this couldn*t be seen through the bottle glass.
but as you say that the contents was green,it must be absinthe.i will try to find out if pernod produced some absinthe related
mixtures,it's all i can do.

ME: I forgot to mention to you the cork had been removed at some point and the hole was covered with dirt. I used compressed air to clean the dirt from the top of the cork so that the dirt wouldn't fall in. Once the dirt was cleaned the hole was obvious. I hadn't mentioned it as it isn't that important considering the main important fact is that this is not vintage absinthe. Also this mixture is colored using food coloring. I strained a shot through some filter paper and some of the green dye stained on the paper. Vintage Pernot never contained green dyes. This mixture is very thick so I'm not sure what is in it. The contents are not even the anisett. Pernod only produced absinthe and anisette, It produced the vintage French absinthe and the Spanish version that they continued to produce until the 50's. I've tasted both and can guarantee this tastes nothing like it. This is NOT the contents of the original bottle. Whoever you purchased it from must have filled it themselves. I will expect my money back (including the shipping fees). If I do not receive it I will post negative feedback as well as report you to ebay for fraud. I can back up my fraud complaints. If you aren't sure what the contents are you should list it as contents unknown.

JABI: fraud?
i never did a fraud, i'm a serious seller, the proof of more than 500 positive feedback is the best guarantee.
i bought the bottle on a serious auction,together with many other items.i've sold a few unopened bottles in the past years and never received any complaint.if you charge me for fraudelence, there will be no more discussions!
i can have my doubts as well, i wasn't present when you opened the bottle,maybe you sold the original contents and replaced it and want me to refund the money! i could threat you for fraud as well, since i never met any collector who drank absinthe of
400$ of value!
therefore i'm def not prepared to refund the money,you might inform ebay accordingly, i will of course do the same
and for the negative feedback i have to possibility to add my comments as well!
you're the first canadian collector who reacted like that and i'm really disappointed.
needless to contact me ,i will not answer your mails any more.


ME: feedback left for Jabi by me:
Beware !!! Sells FAKE items and refuses a refund when they are proven FAKE

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