|By _blackjack_ on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 08:56 am: Edit|
Also, had Gore shifted left far enough tho pick up Nader voters, he would have lost a MUCH larger segment in the center. The fact is, had Nader not beeen in the race, Gore would have had a clear victory. Who is at fault is up for debate.
What a ride. I started watching Buffy with Gore holding Florida (and thus, the race--two days ago I said whoever won Florida would win...), checked in halfway through Angel with Florida a toss-up again, went to be with NBC and CNN declaring BUsh the winner, and woke up to a toss-up again. The only way this race could be more exiting would be if, y'know, I actually liked any of the candidates.
We are probably looking at an electoral inversion, tho, which should hopefully be the end of the electoral college...
|By Bob_chong on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 08:53 am: Edit|
Regarding your "prediction":
Of course 2004 won't be Bush/Gore. Assuming that Bush maintains the edge: the only sitting VP to lose an election after an eight-year run and still come back (in modern times, anyway) was Nixon. And even Nixon had to wait eight years, not four, until he headed the ticket. Thus, by removing the possibility of Gore running again, your "prediction" is fulfilled.
If Gore somehow wins, I believe that Bush cannot and will not run again. This was his shot.
|By Don_walsh on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 08:23 am: Edit|
Gore couldn't be seen to take nader seriously or to engage with him as a peer, or else he'd offend at least a very vocal segment of the Jewish vote. Nader is a very outspoken champion of Arab causes (being one himself.)
|By Pataphysician on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 07:47 am: Edit|
You can't pin this one on Nader. As he's fond of saying, if Gore can't beat a lazy, stupid governor of a state that brings up the rear in everything, then it's Gore's own fault. Besides, I don't think the numbers really bear it out. Nader got less than 2% in Florida and I don't think those people would have turned out at all if Nader weren't running.
Anyway, I got pretty pissed off at my Democrat friends over this "spoiler" thing. They got really indignant at Nader that he wouldn't somehow turn over his votes to Gore, as if Gore had some natural right to them. Gore had a whole year to earn those same votes. Gore should have addressed strongly and clearly the issues that were driving people to Nader. Gore should have engaged Nader in debate so that he could win over Nader voters, instead of shutting Nader out. I kept waiting for Gore to aggressively go after Nader voters by talking specifically about how he'll do the right thing on the environment, the failed drug war, defense spending, etc. But Gore didn't do a damn thing to earn Nader's votes, he was too worried about losing his rightwing.
|By Don_walsh on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 03:10 am: Edit|
Petermarc, I think you called it about right. I feel like a republican Roman senator at about the time Caligula was offed. Vox populi...
|By Petermarc on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 02:31 am: Edit|
i got my info from french co-workers this morning...they knew before me, and actually care
about usa politics...i had to explain that it doesn't make any difference...i agree with don concerning the qualifications of bush compared to the yocals before...people can whine
about america going down the tubes, but this has been happening since after WW2...no president can make any difference, other than image, and with money, it doesn't matter how big of a dumb shit you are, people and countries will still kiss your ass...america is a self-centered, world-blind place, the rest of the planet is either a vacation destination, factory,or cheap labor camp, that must be occationally policed in order to insure supply...enjoy
(i'm not stupid, i'm still keeping my citizenship...)
|By Marc on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 02:04 am: Edit|
America is taking a tumble down the rabbit hole.
As I write, there is no winner in the Presidential election. Gore is leading in the popular vote. The electoral vote is in limbo. This is wild.
|By Don_walsh on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 12:35 am: Edit|
The curse of the vice presidency rules.
Marc (and all) I am no fan of GWBJr. However to call him less qualified than, say, Jimmy the Carter, or Bill Clinton, is going a stretch, don't you think?
One was a peanut farming southern governor with a background as a USN 'nuckulah enginee-ah.' The other, another southern governor who was a life support system for his prick. Soon to be disbarred for obstruction of justice, while governor. Nearly impeached while president. A pair of national embarrasments to be sure, and neither more qualified than Bush Jr. as far as I can tell.
We might consider barring southern governors from holding any higher office. Based on the above track record.
Anyway you are right about one thing: Nader lost this one for the Demos just like Perot torpedoed Bush Sr. (and later Dole).
A plague on both parties' houses.
|By Marc on Wednesday, November 08, 2000 - 12:04 am: Edit|
I also voted for Nader. I live in New York. I knew Gore had New York sewn up, so I voted for a guy whose ideas I liked. Now that Nader may have been the spoiler that got Bush elected, I feel karmically linked to Gore's downfall. Nader's political career is over. He will be seen as the guy who helped elect the most unqualified President in this country's history.
|By Marc on Tuesday, November 07, 2000 - 11:42 pm: Edit|
It's a day of shame in America. The jug-earred, mouth-breathing, beer swilling idiot from Texas
is now the leader of the most powerful nation on the planet. I am sick to my soul.
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