Hard Liquor Ads

Sepulchritude Forum: The Absinthe Forum Archive Thru March 2002: Archive thru January 2002:Hard Liquor Ads
By Chevalier on Wednesday, December 19, 2001 - 09:45 am: Edit

e.e. cummings would be proud, sort of.

By Heiko on Wednesday, December 19, 2001 - 04:07 am: Edit

Oh no, that reminds me of a stupid poem I had to "translate" recently for a linguistics class:


Assert ten barren love day made
Dan wood her hart buy nigh tan day.
Butt wen knee begged she'd marry hymn
The crewel bell may dancer neigh.

Eugene Fields, A Play on Words


Typical linguist's joke, if you ask me (anyone not a linguist will hardly ever find those funny)

By Artist on Wednesday, December 19, 2001 - 01:42 am: Edit

Heartbeat, it's a lovebeat...

By Don_Walsh on Wednesday, December 19, 2001 - 01:09 am: Edit

And I love you too.

You give good Prosthesis.

By Head_Prosthesis on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 10:18 pm: Edit

"erous..."
I love Don.
There I said it, it's out there.

By Don_Walsh on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 09:37 pm: Edit

OK, OK, I gotta run now, have to go check the currency exchange rate for dollars vs those new erous...

By Etienne on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 05:34 pm: Edit

Don;
Thanks for the response. Likewise for filling in some blank spots. Like you said, there's much more involved than what's up front. I would dearly love to hear what was done to quiet the action on the AK. I've owned two and I think that they're the best (overall) military weapon ever designed, but quiet they're not.

By Artist on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 05:24 pm: Edit

Lettuce knot own lea bee write, butt strait four ward, two.

(Not a single error, according to Mr. Gates...)

By Mr_Rabid on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 05:09 pm: Edit

Dam strate!

Down with the speling poleese!

By Artist on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 05:09 pm: Edit

People who live in glass houses should not pass kidney stones...

By Head_Prosthesis on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 04:50 pm: Edit

He who is without trivial, spelling or grammatical error may cast the first stone...

By Artemis on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 04:03 pm: Edit

"A brain transplant might help."

Take it easy on Uncle. Any friend of Head P. couldn't be too bad of a guy. I have a feeling he throws Urban Legends upon the unwary like so many gladiator net-em & gig-em nets.

By Don_Walsh on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 07:53 am: Edit

Etienne, in my 25 years of dealing with those special users, and trying to supply their needs, my observation was and is that they expect the impossible. The hostage rescue types want complete silence and total lethality, and ignore the noise made by a projectile hitting a body (even a .22! makes a hell of a racket when it hits a 100 kg sack of water which is more or less what a human body is.

I can make a .22 pistol sound like a BB gun, a 9mm SMG sound like an older IBM Selectric, but I can't do much about the impact noise.

The AK is a frustrating weapon to suppress, but it has been done, with subsonic ammo and a modified mechanism. I was one of the first to analyze and evaluate Soviet AK suppressor technology out of Afghanistan in the early 80s -- the DIA sent a guy to my house in Arlington to photograph what we had, temporarily, in our hands. (It was lousy. Not all Soviet silencers were lousy but the AK one is.)

There were three of us doing good work. Myself, 'Mickey' Finn and Reed Knight. H&K, whose German stuff sucked, first turned to Mickey, and later when Mickey's engineer defected to Reed, they switched to Knight.

By Bjacques on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 07:16 am: Edit

Oh-kay! Now throw in a few posts about cigs and you have the purview of our favorite jack-booted agency...

By Etienne on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 06:43 am: Edit

Welcome Don, I was hoping you'd notice and jump in. I agree with your point about ammunition, it's all rather useless unless you've managed to lower the velocity of the round. The H&K Mk23 is already threaded for a supressor but they're such big things that concealment is difficult. Of course that AK we were talking about is just about impossible, supressed or not, that bolt carrier rocketing about makes so much noise that the silencer is pointless. The noise of the action itself is usually forgotten when thinking about these things. I've been told that, despite all the romantic notions, a .22 is one of the best choices for supression, and a favorite with people in certain branches of government.

By Don_Walsh on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 03:52 am: Edit

And, unc, you really ought to have that dyslexia looked after. 'eroupean'? 'thier'? A brain transplant might help. Or maybe special ed.

By Don_Walsh on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 03:48 am: Edit

Well, unc, the difference between you and me is that you read SOF, and SOF wrote about me. (In 1982.) Bob Brown and I go way back. Before he started that rag. So save your toilet paper and use it as the manufacturer intended. That 'design' doesn't work.

By Uncle on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 03:37 am: Edit

1 silencer= 1 roll of toliet paper,1 empty Pringle's can. Fill can with TP. I learned this in S.O.F when I was 10 years-old. Don't let your kids read your gun magazines.But if you buy a old eastern eroupean pistol thier already threaded for a silencer.

By Don_Walsh on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 11:00 pm: Edit

And by the by, I NEVER dribble when I shoot.

By Don_Walsh on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 10:58 pm: Edit

A Glock isn't a good choice for a suppressor; the mass of the suppressor will interfere with the short-recoil action, unless a mass-decoupling ('Nilson') device is placed between the barrel and the suppressor, and those are finicky critters to build.

Make it a HK P9S or a Beretta 92 or a Walther P38K, though, or even a P7, and you're on. That's assuming that you have dealt with the fact that 9 Para is supersonic by either (1) procuring heavy-ball subsonic loads, or (2) loading some yourself, or (3) installing a velocity-reducing barrel with special groove diameter (of the rifling) to let just enough propellant gas bleed around the projectile, lowering the V-zero to (barely)<950 fps. (approx Mach 1)

Those are the elegant solutions. There are others.

By Mr_Rabid on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 10:22 pm: Edit

Scene: A distinguished figure standing on a basketball court, wearing sweats and a windbreaker.

A professional basketball player is up against him, dribbling left, right, left! The figure in the windbreaker is no match for him.

Suddenly from the windbreaker the figure draws a Glock 9mm, complete with silencer. Three quick poof noises later, and his opponent is out of the game.

Figure raises gun, rotates to expose Nike Swoosh down the side of silencer.

Dialogue: "I'm Don Walsh, and that was Michael Jordan. The new Nike Silent Bastard- Get in the game, or get taken out!"

Fade to black, overlay of silencer. Announcer (whispering) "That Bastard!"

By Tavarua on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 08:44 pm: Edit

Get in the game.

By Don_Walsh on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 07:07 pm: Edit

Hah. a silencer thread and I'm not in it.

By Etienne on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 02:58 pm: Edit

AK-47's are great fun, and one of the easiest to find "those parts" for. The BATF has, however, successfully prosecuted people for having the gun and conversion parts at the same time, even if no work has been done. Full-auto firearms are a rich man's hobby, the guns cost the world, and I couldn't even afford the ammo bill. Eight hundred rounds a minute indeed!

By Heiko on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 02:55 pm: Edit

Etienne,
I guess the hassles you have to go through to get a little gun in Europe is even more than if you want to buy a silenced automatic weapon in the States. If you finally have your gun, you'll be registered at 20 different places and need to carry your licence around with you all the time and you'll only be allowed to use your weapon at certain designated places (can't just go in the woods and shoot!) - a silencer is then really not to be considered dangerous anymore...

By Heiko on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 02:49 pm: Edit

"what would I do with a full-auto weapon...."

you'd be the king of the hood ;-)

By Chrysippvs on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 01:36 pm: Edit

You can get them at gun shows in MS for around 100 per silencer, as I recall, you can have a silencer as long as your register it with the ATF (~$200 USD).

Gun Shows have all kinds of crazy stuff and equally (if not more) crazy people vending....I saw an AK-47 at one a while back for 200 USD with what seemed to be the guys wife selling the firing pins and auto-kits for 15 in the next booth....but I had to ask myself..what would I do with a full-auto weapon....

By Etienne on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 01:17 pm: Edit

I also understand that they're much more readily available in Europe, where it's considered good manners not to disturb your neighbors with the noise if you target shoot. Mind, this is just what I've been told, I could be wrong.

By Etienne on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 01:12 pm: Edit

The issue in making a silencer is not so much in making one as in making one that will last more than two or three shots. It's something I get asked about occasionally at the store, and like automatic conversions, is something we don't talk about much. Not much point in advising someone involved in the comission of a crime. I think that this would account for the reaction you have received at gun shows. The BATF is a wealth of information concerning the legal aspects of such things.

By Tavarua on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 12:58 pm: Edit

"you can build fairly good silencers on your own with not too much technical knowledge, can't you?"

I had thought this and consulted The Anarchist Cookbook. Actually, building a quality functioning silencer is not that easy at all even an amateurish one. It's not like a Steven Seagull movie where you can tape a 2 liter bottle to the end of your barrel and you have a silencer.

"You can buy silencers in many states"

Apparently this is the case, it just amazed me. I have gone to a lot of gun / sportsman shows and have asked a few times. Every time I do I get a "are you out of your mind" look and am told that it will automatically buy you five years in the clink. However, recently in a Combat Handguns magazine I saw them for sale. I seriously doubt I would ever get one, because I am unaware what the exact laws are and getting an precise answer on an issue like this would likely be impossible, as with knife carry laws. They tend to be interpreted differently by everyone. Beside the price, around 600 USD and the fact that I would have no need for one except for novelty value.

As to your other point, I am not concerned with guns or any weapons, more concerned with the people that possess them. You could go in the backyard and pick up a stick that would do as much damage to an individual as a handgun.

By Etienne on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 07:33 am: Edit

There's nothing new about any of this. It's been law since the thirties, when the Feds started licensing automatic firearms.

By Etienne on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 07:29 am: Edit

Tav;

You can buy silencers in many states (I don't know exactly how many) But as far as I know it has nothing to do with any "gray areas". It simply requires a federal registration, with a transfer fee, and a class 3 license, same as with automatic weapons. The state where I live (Mich) does not allow this unless you're an FFL holder doing business with law enforcement agencies.

By Heiko on Monday, December 17, 2001 - 04:30 am: Edit

I would worry more about the guns than the silencers.

It doesn't matter if you're shot silently or not, you're dead anyways...
btw. you can build fairly good silencers on your own with not too much technical knowledge, can't you?
Don can probably tell us better the difference between a good industrial silencer and a homemade one.

By Tavarua on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 07:03 pm: Edit

This really is fairly big news, I heard about it several times before checking out your thread. What I find funny is that you can legally purchase pistol silencers in 35 states now because of gray areas in the law, and this is not news and you probably wouldn't even know unless you are a gun enthusiast.

By Bjacques on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 01:44 am: Edit

On Dutch TV there are a lot of wine cooler commercials and a few for Johnnie Walker ("Keep Walking"). The first, and most often repeated, features Harvey Keitel walking through the Colosseum, encountering phantasmagoric and fiery allegorical but abstract figures. Lots of sinister eyes. He says (in a voiceover) that he conquers the psychological pressures of acting by walking through them.

Which gave me an idea...



SCENE: NONDESCRIPT INTERROGATION ROOM. MEANT TO BE U.S. MARINE CAMP RHINO, KANDAHAR, AFGHANISTAN

SHOT: TWO MIDDLE-AGED WHITE MEN, FACING JOHN WALKER. ALL THREE ARE SEATED. POV IS FROM JUST BEHIND JW'S HEAD, SO GENERIC ACTOR CAN BE USED

JW (VO): I walked a long way to get here. My parents loved me and gave me everything under the sun.

CLIP: (1 second) "SERIAL" (A 1980 MOVIE ABOUT LAIDBACK MARIN COUNTY) SUNNY AFTERNOON HOT TUB PARTY

JW: They encouraged me to find my own path

SHOT: (1 second) YOUNG MAN WALKING ALONG NORTHERN CALIFORNIA SEASHORE

JW: And I took a journey inside myself

SHOT: (1 sec) INTENSE YOUNG MAN STARING INTO PC MONITOR IN DARK ROOM. ON DESK ARE RAP CDs

CLIP: (2 sec) "PULP FICTION": JULES SAYING "I'M GOING TO WALK THE WORLD"

JW: My journey took me to the other end of the earth...

STILL: GUIDE DE LA ROUTARD (FRENCH VERSION OF "LET'S GO") GUY DONE UP IN ARAB DRESS. AFGHANISTAN MARKED IN RED ON GLOBE/BACKPACK (1 sec)

CLIP: (1/2 sec) "MY SON THE FANATIC" (1997): UK PAKISTANI TAXI DRIVER'S FUNDAMENTALIST SON IN RIOT

CLIP: (1 sec) "LAWRENCE OF ARABIA": PETER O' TOOLE LEADING RAID ON AQABA

JW: ...and I found my place in a just society.

CLIP: (1 sec) "DEATH OF A PRINCESS" (1980): EXECUTIONS. HE IS SHOT, SHE IS BEHEADED. OR IS IT VICE VERSA?

CLIP: (1 sec) BLOODSTAINED EXECUTION WALL IN AFGHANISTAN

JW: But the unbelievers caught up to me

CLIP: (1 sec) "APOCALYPSE NOW": G.I.'S BUMRUSHING PLAYGIRLS U.S.O. SHOW

JW: So I had to start walking again...

MONTAGE: CNN BATTLE FOOTAGE; MAZAR-E SHARIF PRISON RIOT

(BACK TO INTERROGATION ROOM)

TWO MARINES ENTER

MARINE #1: All right, on your feet

FADEOUT

FADEIN JOHNNIE WALKER LOGO ON BLACK BACKGROUND

VO: "Johnnie Walker: Keep Walking"

By Artist on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 11:37 am: Edit

One other thing:

The ad must air during a show where the majority of the viewing audience is over 21.

Also, local station and cable do and did carry hard liquor ads...

By Artemis on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 07:41 am: Edit

"I thought American tv stations were prohibited by law to do that??"

So did I. Apparently not.

"In Germany we're used to it: Happy model-type boys and girls on tropical islands, smiling and dancing while pouring glass after glass ..."

As I understood it (heard it on Rush Limbaugh's radio show), it's only one TV Network, and they've only accepted advertising from one distiller so far. Some of the rules:

Every actor in the ad must be over 30 years of age.
They may not actually drink the liquor on screen.
The distiller must run so many hours of "public service" anti-drinking propaganda to go along with their pro-liquor propaganda (figure that one out!)
The ad must run after 9 PM.

By Artemis on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 07:36 am: Edit

I heard this on the radio yesterday, and it's of more than vague interest. It could be the death knell for absinthe.

Fade in to Absente TV commercial. "Absinthe" (in the form of Absente, of course) is brought to the attention of the unwashed masses. The "fact" is emphasized that Absente is not harmful to you, unlike that nasty wormwood stuff of old .....

An Absente ad in the pages of Cigar Afficionado can only do so much damage. At halftime of the Super Bowl, it's an entirely different monster.

By Bob_Chong on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 07:28 am: Edit

What *is* prohibited in commercials is the image of the literal, physical imbimbing of an alcoholic beverage. Beer, wine, or liquor--doesn't matter. Weird, huh?

By Giovannigray on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 01:03 am: Edit

Heiko..

As I understand it from all the news about this today, stations (or networks) are not specifically PROHIBITED. It was a "voluntary" agreement of some years ago, for the sake of "public health".

(If anybody can elaborate, that would be great.)

By Heiko on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 12:54 am: Edit

I thought American tv stations were prohibited by law to do that??

In Germany we're used to it: Happy model-type boys and girls on tropical islands, smiling and dancing while pouring glass after glass of Bacardi; vodka bottles breaking out of the ice of the northpole to classical ouvertures, a deep and sincere voice telling us that vodka gorbatchov is "the pure soul of vodka"; an eagle flying through thunderstorms over the mountains, then the weather gets better, the eagle comes closer and carries a bottle of Fernet Branca, "it's said to have magical powers..."
...

By Mr_Rabid on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 12:13 am: Edit

Absolut- when there is Absolutly nothing left to do than drink yourself to death!

{picture of a coffin with a bottle-neck shaped top}

By Petermarc on Friday, December 14, 2001 - 10:45 am: Edit

fade in-
dirty whited-socked(hole in big toe) feet, propped up on a cheap coffee table, pizza box with coagulated crust, vodka bottle 3/4 empty, snow and white noise on the tv...

'when you've reached 30, and you're not a sports star, laid off from work, can't pay the rent, girlfriend left you, and the on-line provider dropped you; you always know you have -hard liquor- as a friend...
-hard liquor-
always there to keep you company while you waste your life watching infomercials until 3 am...'

fade out-music '...this dyin' slowly, it's better than shootin' myself...'

By Verawench on Friday, December 14, 2001 - 10:18 am: Edit

Of some vague interest:

http://money.cnn.com/2001/12/13/companies/nbc/

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