|By Lordhobgoblin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 12:42 pm: Edit|
Sure the picture is funny and for that alone it has merit. It is a damn good picture.
But as for Kennedy, well big deal. World leaders come and world leaders go, it's been like that since the rise of ancient 'civilizations'. To rate Kennedy's assasination as some Earth-shattering landmark in the 3 million years of human history is narrow-minded and naive in the extreme. He was just one power-crazed cunt like the rest of them, he was nothing special.
I know many people who would not recognise a photo of Jack Ruby and Lee Harvey Oswald. Does that make them a bunch of uneducated morons? No it does not! One's 'education' takes many forms and has many different facets. Different people have different areas of expertise and knowledge. To choose one limited example and brand all those who are not knowledgable about this as uneducated shows a very narrow view of 'education'.
I was drunk when I made the post but no, I was not being sarcastic. Kennedy's death may be of very significant importance to the past 50 years of history of the USA but the remember that their is more to the world than the USA, and their is a hell of a lot more to man's development than the past 50 years of history.
So Marc, I'll keep my 'McBuddhism'as you put it and you just keep on believing in your Coca-cola soaked, 20th century-centred, 'rock and roll' view of man's development with the USA as the be-all and end-all of everything and with history not going any further back than the 1950's. I suppose in that context Kennedy's death was one of the most important events. But in a broader view it was no more than a blip and a very common blip at that, no big deal really.
|By Louched_Liver on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 11:21 am: Edit|
"I dont think anyone is laughing at the 'expense of murder', but the cleverness of the modification to the picture."
Which, because of it's iconographic status, is well known, and therefore more folks can appreciate the modification.
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 09:58 am: Edit|
Raschied, interpretations can differ.
Here are the song's lyrics. On one level, they're criticizing the establishment for persecuting Dwyer, and the media for filming (and in one instance, broadcasting) his suicide. On the other hand, there's a feeling that Dwyer's act, rebellious and desperate, was somehow impressive and admirable. And to me, that's a sick idea.
Raschied, when you call a man who committed suicide "'ol Budd", I gotta question how serious you are about it.
HEY MAN, NICE SHOT (Richard Patrick, "Filter")
i wish i would've met you
now it's a little late
what you could've taught me
i could have saved some face
they think that your early ending
was all wrong
for the most part they're right
but look how they all got strong
that's why i say hey man, nice shot.
now that the smoke's gone
and the air is all clear
those who were right there
got a new kind of fear
you'd fight and you were right
but they were just too strong
they'd stick it in your face
and let you smell what they consider wrong.
that's why i say hey man, nice shot.
what a good shot man.
i wish i would have met you
i wish i would have met you
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 09:46 am: Edit|
The picture is clever, but I feel very strongly that it takes the lowest road. Papered over is the horror of a brutal crime, a murder, agony. I don't want you to remove the picture. What I wanted (and got) was the chance to say what it meant to me. I also wanted to believe that you take these things seriously.
|By Raschied on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 09:38 am: Edit|
Chevalier, before you get your panties in a bunch about Filter, you should realize that the member of the band who wrote "Hey man, Nice Shot" saw Budd Dwyer kill himself LIVE on TV when he was sixteen. The song was the band member's way of dealing with the ugliness he was forced to watch without a choice. Ol' Budd pulled the trigger before anyone had a chance to even change the channel.
|By Lint on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 09:24 am: Edit|
Do you want me to remove the picture? If it bothers you that much i will. I dont think anyone is laughing at the 'expense of murder', but the cleverness of the modification to the picture.
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 08:47 am: Edit|
Lint, LL and Marc, the photo is a cheap, sick laugh at the expense of a murder.
I'm sure that Oswald's and Ruby's families got a real kick out of it.
That's about as foul as the band Filter's song, "Hey Man, Nice Shot", which congratulates R. Budd Dwyer for blowing his brains out on television. Go ahead: see and hear what a distraught man's gunshot suicide is really like (in living technicolor!) at http://welcome.to/budd-dwyer Then shut up.
Grow up, people.
|By Nancywhiskey on Monday, March 25, 2002 - 11:25 pm: Edit|
You can not stick your elbow on your ear.Try it.
|By Marccampbell on Monday, March 25, 2002 - 09:10 pm: Edit|
I hope hobgoblin was being sarcastic because a comment like that coming from a teacher is a dismaying thought. I hope he doesn't teach history or political science.
|By Crowlyman on Monday, March 25, 2002 - 08:47 pm: Edit|
Actually it sounded to me like LordHobgoblin was being sarcastic, but I don't know-I haven't been here that long to know how he reacts to topics...
|By Blue on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 11:24 pm: Edit|
HobG -- purely as a defense, the only way for folks still looking at 'Optimism as a Revolutionary Concept' (still my favorite character motivation ever) to survive, is to study the past, and to realize that they are in grave physical danger.
|By Nancywhiskey on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 04:16 pm: Edit|
Hobgob, some education that will do you good and something interesting to pass along can be found in the Copper Penny Test. Not many on this planet past or present have been privy to the results of this experiment and what it was intended for. You can see the procedure for preforming the test in the Canto III chat.
|By Timk on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 04:15 pm: Edit|
right on Mr. Campbell
|By Marccampbell on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 04:09 pm: Edit|
your comments about the irrelevency of the Kennedy
assasination is among the dumbest things I've ever read in this forum. Living in the moment doesn't mean willfully ignoring the past. Your fast food philosophy is McBuddhism.
|By Lint on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 02:50 pm: Edit|
Sorry I didnt clarify, the type of education I was speaking of is the type that benefits the holder...
|By Lordhobgoblin on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 02:27 pm: Edit|
What good is being able to "show some education". What good is education if it doesn't do you any good?
What difference does it make to a person's life whether or not he can recognise Jack Ruby or Lee Harvey Oswald? It makes fuck all difference, that's what. So let's not pat ourselves on the back and look down our noses at others. Let's not kid ourselves that we are the intelligent, educated ones because we can recognise a bunch of old has-beens.
The past is over and all that exists is the present.
|By Mvario on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 02:11 pm: Edit|
It's important because it was one of the only visible actions in the coup that redefined the course of America. Those responsible are still in power.
...and the Dead Kennedys Rock!
|By Louched_Liver on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 02:05 pm: Edit|
W/out the historical context, the picture don't really mean shit, now does it?
|By Lint on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 01:57 pm: Edit|
I think its impotant for people to recognize that picture because its a part of history, and being able to recognize it shows at least 'some' education...no?
history isnt to just be forgotten. History is a lot of fun to study.
|By Lordhobgoblin on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 01:44 pm: Edit|
Anyway why should people care what the picture is really of? Kennedy's dead, who cares? It's ancient history. So what? What relevance is that incident to people today? No relevance at all. People have more important things to think about. Kennedy was killed, big deal, millions of people have killed since he died.
|By Louched_Liver on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 11:04 am: Edit|
"You'd be surprised how many people dont even know what the picutre is really of."
Sadly, I wouldn't.
|By Lint on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 10:53 am: Edit|
I scanned it out of a book that documents punk posters from the late 60's on. It was a picture used for a DK flier (notice the spray paint on the back wall). Ive seen it online a few times. You'd be surprised how many people dont even know what the picutre is really of.
|By Marccampbell on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 04:13 am: Edit|
it compresses the last half of the 20th century into one evocative, mindtwisting, profound image.
it resonates. like some badass feedback from the Devil's twin reverb.
|By Louched_Liver on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 04:04 am: Edit|
Like it? You think I like it?
I FUCKING LOVE IT!!
Everyone needs to enjoy it. Did you concoct it, or find it?
|By Lint on Saturday, March 23, 2002 - 11:53 pm: Edit|
that would be me...lint, glad you like it
|By Louched_Liver on Saturday, March 23, 2002 - 12:15 pm: Edit|
Alright, since Jockeyass Siccy reminded me of it, and neither of us can remember who's it was-
Who has the Jack Ruby, Lee Harvey jam session picture? It's the fuckin' most!
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