|By Head_Prosthesis on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 08:36 pm: Edit|
Well Pikkle, I've been lickin' the bottom of a shoe called alcohol for quite a few years now...
Occasionally a clever DK illustration or two suprisingly escapes my notice.
On the other hand Big Titties? I'm all over those, boiy!
|By Marccampbell on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 08:20 pm: Edit|
I said as much. though I called it amusing.
|By Pikkle on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 08:20 pm: Edit|
That photo has been floating around the net for years... even in my polluting (yeah, fuck you Marc, hahahahahaaaaa!!!!) decrepit, culturally devoid workplace it found a spot on the bulletin board for a number of weeks years ago... where have you guys been?
|By Head_Prosthesis on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 08:13 pm: Edit|
but Marc, it's so fucking funny
|By Marccampbell on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 07:39 pm: Edit|
there was no double post. oops.
For those who may curious about my friendship with Jello, he was my bands roadie in 1976.
|By Marccampbell on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 07:37 pm: Edit|
sorry about the double post
|By Marccampbell on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 07:36 pm: Edit|
I am close friends with Jello Biafra of the Dead Kennedys. I called him earlier and left a message
with his service. I expect he'll call back soon and I plan to ask him about the photo. But, I think I know what he is going to say:
even the worst tragedies that have occurred in this country almost immediately become pop culture "events". The photo of Oswald being shot was repeated over and over again on television, just as the media have done with the planes crashing into the Twin Towers. The effect is numbing.
We become dead to the emotional power of the horror of the moment. It eventually becomes nothing more than electronic stimulation, divorced from actual meaning and emotion. By doctoring that photo, Jello, was making a very profound statement about the media's ability
to transform something awful into an "event" that can be used to attract viewers. To take a murder and turn it into a "show". The photo also shows us that the media cannot be trusted, just as The Warren Report cannot be trusted. If jello can alter the truth by fucking with the photo, imagine what the government can do with evidence and our perception of the truth. Jello also makes an interesting statement about a culture that puts "news events" on the same level as sitcoms and soap operas. TV reduces everything to the same level, its all showbiz. Rock and roll.
I am surprised by the lack of nuance in some of the posts here regarding the photo. I think the photo is a political act, a dadaist act and is intended to provoke more than amuse. Though, it is amusing.
|By Marccampbell on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 07:18 pm: Edit|
As someone who marched on the Pentagon when I was 15 and read Eldridge Cleaver's SOUL ON ICE when I was 17 (1968), I've always questioned my country's politics, disagreed with much of it and protested against it. I am protesting still. I hate what American corporations are doing to this planet. I know we are being fed tons of misinformation and lied to about the current war. I resent it and I am angry.
I am ashamed that my fellow countrymen are not examining things intelligently. They are too
lazy to educate themselves about what is really going on in the world. I have been reading alternative views on the "war on terrorism", including the writings of Tariq Ali,
Michel Chossudovsky, Noam Chomsky, Barbara Kingsolver, Michael Parenti and Howard Zinn. I've pissed alot of people off by not buying into the company line. The USA does not own the world (though it appears we'd like to), we are not the guardians or stewards of the entire planet, and it
is not our job to tell people how to live. By trying to control the future of other countries and their people, we have earned their mistrust and resentment. No one likes being told what to do by a bully and no one wants to see their countries resources stolen from them.
I don't drink coca cola. And I haven't set foot in a McDonalds in 4 decades.
As far as me being a rock and roller:
I love rock and roll because I believe it has the power to change things. It changed my life. It has changed the planet. My teachers and heroes have been cats like John Lennon, Phil Ochs, Bob
Dylan, Patti Smith, Jimi Hendrix Jim Morrison, Marvin Gaye...the list is really quite long.
And its not just about what these artists have to say, it is about an energy and a belief in the transformative powers of art. Rock and roll, like great films, paintings and books, can lift you up and lead you to new spaces, new visions. Rock and roll told me it was okay to enjoy my body, okay to explore my mind and okay to dance wildly and howl at the moon.
|By Mr_Rabid on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 04:16 pm: Edit|
Chevalier- if you take a moment to extrapolate your perspective, you will realize that every human life ends in the blackest tragedy. Yes, that sucked, what happened with Jack Ruby and Oswald.
And it's going to suck when it happens to every other living thing. The price of life is death.
You want to walk around with that firmly in mind as a bad thing, be my guest.
Me, I prefer to laugh at death- there is no other way to survive. It is simply the way it is.
To cry over a murder as opposed to death by another cause- as soon cry over yellow pants and not blue ones.
|By Barsnake on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 04:10 pm: Edit|
Interesting discussion - I was immediately enthralled by the photo - I thought it was a first class parody. I never associated a negative commentary about JFK with it. Merely, as Kallisti says, a thought provoking image. I am of the age that I can tell you exactly where I was when the Kennedy assasination was announced - still remember it perfectly...
More intriguing - remember the Space Shuttle explosion in the 80's? - There were joke about it circulating that very night...I wonder why the difference with 9/11?
Some people need to deal with trauma in peculiar ways. This helps explain the Grand Guignol.
|By Admin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 04:07 pm: Edit|
d00d. peter. dang. can I have more of those?
|By Petermarc on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 04:05 pm: Edit|
|By Admin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 04:00 pm: Edit|
Which I think means there is room for both perspectives. The DK's weren't just bratty assholes. They weren't just trying to be cute & clever. They wanted people to question ... whatever. It was images & songs such as theirs that made me question the world into which I was born, more than any "where have all the flowers gone" crap. But that is a generational thing.
Not all such images are trivializing, and even those that are have a purpose to serve.
But I understand where you're coming from. There's an almost pathalogical disrespect for suffering when any kind of distance from the subject matter exists. But that does not mean the only response from here on out should be to weep.
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 03:26 pm: Edit|
"... when images pass into the public domain this way, they take on more than the sum of their parts." It's true. And that's when empathy can serve us best: to bring back to the equation a sense of the personal.
|By Admin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 03:14 pm: Edit|
I said it takes time ... trust me, they'll be out there eventually, even tho here it might take a few to ten years. But we weren't talking about 9/11. This was nearly 40 years ago now. I'm not saying everyone should find it in good taste after x amount of time, most people won't. But it's not because it's inherently wrong or morally suspect. These are conciousness defining images that have taken on a life of their own. The widows will never find it exceptable, but when images pass into the public domain this way, they take on more than the sum of their parts.
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 03:10 pm: Edit|
Like giggling nervously at a funeral? The problem is that there's a fine line. Anyone around here telling World Trade Center jokes? There are a ton of these jokes going around South America. And I'm not talking about doctored pictures of some guy on the Twin Towers roof with the plane behind him; that's tame. I mean jokes about people frying like Big Macs, falling and trying to use American flags as makeshift parachutes, etc. Funny, huh?
|By Joalco on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 03:06 pm: Edit|
What is it with talking asses today...?
|By Admin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:57 pm: Edit|
Also, let me say, that what I think you're having problems with is the humanization of horror. That's how we process deeply disturbing information, imagery etc. We try and take the horror out of it, place it in a new context. There has to be some distance from the event, but it happens to everything.
If you want to talk about the French Revolution, they lampooned the most grotesque excesses, in song, ballads, dances and costume. Check the "french kiss" section on the url below and read "vive la victime" about the "bal du victimes" ... and those were the SURVIVORS.
And the DK flyer, like a mustache on the mona lisa, it rips away our comfort zones to bare a new perspective. Maybe they felt the same that Hob does "enough already!" ... but it's not just a clever grotesque.
Or maybe it is and I'm just talkin' out my ass. Heh.
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:50 pm: Edit|
Sainte Croix, priez pour moi!
|By Larsbogart on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:43 pm: Edit|
Ok,world leaders may come and world leaders may go,who gives a shit about world leaders anyway?
What was an Earth-shattering landmark in the 3 million years of human history was the suicide/killing of Marilyn Monroe.
|By Admin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:36 pm: Edit|
Chevalier, I think the joke is on you, heh. Have you seen the *other* section of sepulchritude?
currently under renovation.
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:33 pm: Edit|
|By Chrysippvs on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:28 pm: Edit|
That made my day that much better...
|By Chevalier on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:21 pm: Edit|
Hobgoblin wrote: “… the picture is funny and for that alone has merit.”
During France's Reign of Terror, executioners would slap the faces of their decapitated victims. The pale heads would immediately flush a bright red. Spectators would roar with laughter.
And this doesn’t make you sick?
|By Admin on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 02:02 pm: Edit|
Well, duh it's USA centric. They don't teach us much about Admiral Lord Nelson or the Battle of Trafalgar here either. And the Dead Kennedy's were an American band.
It was more a defining american moment than maybe an incident of great historical significance, but I'm not a US history buff able to split hairs on this. The 60's wouldn't have been the 60's in America had they not been sandwiched between the Kennedy assassination & Watergate.
Just like the coming decade(s) will probably be defined by 9/11.
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