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> Doubs Mystique Carte d'Or, Reviewed
OCvertDe
post Mar 30 2008, 05:57 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 30 2008, 11:50 AM) *

OK, so you handed out a 9.5. Big difference.

I never handed out an anything.5 to any of them. It's difficult enough without adding decimals into the mix. I've given out some 9's, but not very many I don't think.


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"Hmmm, someone rated Zima higher than Sam Adams? Well, they both blow, so who gives a rat's ass?" -bob_chong
"Clear things up? Most likely not, but we likes things cloudy around here…" -Petermark
"I can't drink at work. We have no ice." -Selmac
"…but it sure would've been a blast to be there on that night." -Absomphe
"here is what absinthe almost tastes like" -Kirk
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absinthist
post Mar 30 2008, 06:20 PM
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It is difficult enough to get thru all that unnecessary maths.


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Oxygenee
post Mar 30 2008, 06:52 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 30 2008, 06:50 PM) *

This whole notion that average to good absinthes should score in the high 80's and 90's is silly.


No, you're being silly. We've gone over this umpteen times before.

I don't think anyone here is scoring what they consider "average to good absinthes" in the high 80's or 90's.

As I've explained countless times here, the scoring system is based on the Parker wine rating system, which is one of the defacto standards in the industry, widely used in international spirits judging.

In terms of this, a score of below 50 is essentially not possible, unless the product is literally undrinkable, or objectively technically faulty. To put it another way, 50 is the effective baseline score - the "zero" on this system.

Very poor to poor products would rate in the 50's and 60's

Fair products would be low 70's.

Good products would be high 70's and low 80's.

Very good products would be high 80's.

Excellent products would be low 90's.


Superb products would be high 90's, up to and including 100.

It's PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE TO GIVE MODERN ABSINTHES SCORES IN THE 90'S, OR EVEN TO GIVE ONE 100 POINTS. (Parker has given thousands of wines a perfect 100 score btw).

You should NOT REPEAT NOT reserve the 90+ point area for mythical pre-ban, or some theoretically perfect absinthe that exists only in your imagination.

All of the above is not a matter of opinion or debate. it's true by definition. If you don't score according to these parameters, you're not using the system correctly.


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...et c’est l’absinthe enfin, la grande absinthe ou la petite, parure chaste des montagnes et des rivages marins, fille des grand vents purs, blé des espaces vierges, emblème de la liberté farouche.
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Oxygenee
post Mar 30 2008, 07:08 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 30 2008, 06:50 PM) *

No one minds that you like one thing or another, or that you love one absinthe so much more over another. But you haven't given yourself any room to discover something better. The absinthe revival is in it's infancy, and you're scoring things like it's mature.


Wrong, wrong, wrong.

The point of scoring, is to score within your EXISTING parameters of experience, knowledge and taste, NOT to leave the top end of the scoring system blank for some imaginary absinthe that you might taste in the future.

A score of 95 simply means that OCvertDE thought the Doubs was, on the day, an excellent to superb absinthe. That's all. It's not a relative rating system - the fact that he scored this one 95, doesn't preclude him scoring a dozen others the same or higher in future.


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...et c’est l’absinthe enfin, la grande absinthe ou la petite, parure chaste des montagnes et des rivages marins, fille des grand vents purs, blé des espaces vierges, emblème de la liberté farouche.
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OCvertDe
post Mar 30 2008, 07:46 PM
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"Doubs Mystique "Carte d'or" is a superb ultra-premium absinthe distilled in century old alambics in Pontarlier, in the heart of the Doubs region of eastern France, the historical home of absinthe.

Our aim in formulating and distilling Doubs Mystique Carte d'or was simple: we wanted to make, absolutely without regard to cost or technical difficulties, the finest, most complex, most delicious absinthe possible."

QUOTE(Oxygenee @ Mar 30 2008, 03:08 PM) *

A score of 95 simply means that OCvertDE thought the Doubs was, on the day, an excellent to superb absinthe.


Indeed. As far as I'm concerned, I've finally found a product that lives up to it's own hype. Until I tasted it, I assumed this was just the same old pompous self promotion most every product spews about itself, which usually is a case of situational ethics at best, blatant false advertising at the worst.

For good reason I waited until I was in a position to review selections widely accepted to be both excellent and terrible, and everything in between, which is why out of nowhere I posted ten reviews in three days. I have no experience with the holy grail pre ban legends, nor the hypothetical revelations of the future creations, which puts me in the vast majority I think. I want a BG that is relevant today. If it needs to be updated in the future, so be it, but I think it's as good as it can be without a crystal ball.


--------------------
"Hmmm, someone rated Zima higher than Sam Adams? Well, they both blow, so who gives a rat's ass?" -bob_chong
"Clear things up? Most likely not, but we likes things cloudy around here…" -Petermark
"I can't drink at work. We have no ice." -Selmac
"…but it sure would've been a blast to be there on that night." -Absomphe
"here is what absinthe almost tastes like" -Kirk
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dakini_painter
post Mar 30 2008, 09:36 PM
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QUOTE

or higher in future.


Let's see, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100. No more higher than that. End of the scale.
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OCvertDe
post Mar 30 2008, 09:54 PM
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It's also worth mentioning that my 95 is not going to kick the average up to 95. In fact, it will only raise the average about one point, which for all practical purposes still leaves 15 points for improvement of future discoveries, just not by me.

With regards to that, the Jade PF 1901 is better liked by most than the Doubs Mystique, and I didn't like it as much. The likelihood is exceptionally high that no matter what else I try or how much better most people perceive it to be, Mystique will remain very near the top of my preference. While I appreciate your concern for the hole I am potentially digging myself, rest assured that your apprehension is most likely misplaced, and I really don't foresee the problem you forecast for me.


--------------------
"Hmmm, someone rated Zima higher than Sam Adams? Well, they both blow, so who gives a rat's ass?" -bob_chong
"Clear things up? Most likely not, but we likes things cloudy around here…" -Petermark
"I can't drink at work. We have no ice." -Selmac
"…but it sure would've been a blast to be there on that night." -Absomphe
"here is what absinthe almost tastes like" -Kirk
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Shabba53
post Mar 30 2008, 11:22 PM
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That's the idea of having a scoring system. It averages out the highs and lows. By having room for explanations, it allows the reader to insert him or herself in regards to their tastes. They can identify more with one review or another and educate themselves.

As we've already seen, there are some people who penalize an absinthe for the same reason why another person gives it a higher score.
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OCvertDe
post Mar 31 2008, 11:07 AM
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Exactly. As someone said to me awhile ago: "review the reviewer".

Ever since it was driven home to me that no one was going to come around to my use of maths in relative values of absinthes, I've paid about as much attention to the scores as I've paid to those whose opinions I don't agree with. All I really look at now in the BG is the average score and the tasting notes themselves of the people I've found my tastes tend to coincide with.


--------------------
"Hmmm, someone rated Zima higher than Sam Adams? Well, they both blow, so who gives a rat's ass?" -bob_chong
"Clear things up? Most likely not, but we likes things cloudy around here…" -Petermark
"I can't drink at work. We have no ice." -Selmac
"…but it sure would've been a blast to be there on that night." -Absomphe
"here is what absinthe almost tastes like" -Kirk
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dakini_painter
post Mar 31 2008, 01:16 PM
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QUOTE

It averages out the highs and lows.


Only if you have enough reviews to actually cause that to happen.

And OC, where I have reviewed you? Where have I made any negative statement about you?

You say you can't imagine a better absinthe than the Mystique. That's certainly a good reason to give something a high score, but to rate it as the best there will ever be, seems limiting.

Since I'm so obviously wrong, I'll just keep my opinion to myself.



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Helfrich
post Mar 31 2008, 01:35 PM
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I'll have a little piece of your opinion just because it tastes good.


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Absomphe
post Mar 31 2008, 01:54 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 31 2008, 06:16 AM) *

That's certainly a good reason to give something a high score, but to rate it as the best there will ever be, seems limiting.


To imply that, he would have to have given it a 100, but aside from that, numbers, although they are more precise than verbiage, are by there very nature, also more self-limiting. Two absinthes could both score a 100, but if one's verbal assessment of Absinthe A waxes more rhapsodic than one's description of Absinthe B, then obviously the reviewer preferred absinthe A. I don't think there will ever be a numerical scoring system that can account for the number of subtle gradiations that comprise preference.

Personally, if I had to make choice, I'd rather read a very detailed descriptive review of an absinthe, and forgo the numbers ratings, than read a set of numerical ratings, sans verbal descriptors, but I certainly see the need for both. The numbers are basically the skeletal framework of a review, whereas the verbiage is its flesh, and blood.


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Shabba53
post Mar 31 2008, 02:19 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 31 2008, 09:16 AM) *

but to rate it as the best there will ever be, seems limiting.

That's where you don't seem to get it. Just because an absinthe scores even a perfect 100 doesn't mean that it's the best that there will ever be. It just means that the taster believes at that point that the absinthe is the epitomy of what an absinthe should be. That doesn't mean he won't find something he likes even more in the future. That future absinthe will probably also score a 100.

Like Oxy said, there have been thousands of wines that have all scored a perfect 100, but why would that preclude another from doing so in the future?
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Oxygenee
post Mar 31 2008, 02:38 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 31 2008, 04:16 PM) *

Since I'm so obviously wrong, I'll just keep my opinion to myself.


Relax. If being wrong was the criteria for not expressing an opinion, there'd be far fewer posts here…and some well known members wouldn't be able to post at all… harhar.gif





--------------------
...et c’est l’absinthe enfin, la grande absinthe ou la petite, parure chaste des montagnes et des rivages marins, fille des grand vents purs, blé des espaces vierges, emblème de la liberté farouche.
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post Mar 31 2008, 04:22 PM
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QUOTE(dakini_painter @ Mar 30 2008, 07:50 AM) *
I can see mthulli handing out a very rare (perhaps unique) pre-ban from Lyon.

Really? Time to call Air France.


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