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> Question to FV, -- not sure if this is the right place to post this topic --
Shabba53
post Apr 15 2010, 07:20 PM
Post #16


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Pompous by saying that people recognized the WS?

Pompous by saying I have fun teaching?

Seems to me, the 'Fuck everyone, they get what they deserve' comment is more pompous.


Think of it what you will. I've no illusions that I'll win anyone over on this site. Beliefs and opinions are too deeply rooted at this point.
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Tibro
post Apr 15 2010, 08:09 PM
Post #17


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He may have been referring to your self-aggrandizing way of making a point by pointing out what swell, helpful shlub you are. Thank you for pointing that out. And if you and that swell, helpful forum you commend needs to ban, er, expel from class a few obstreperous rowdies so the good mannered folk in the first row aren't distracted from their lessons, then so be it. What do we know about it, anyway.


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Then I try to convince myself that it is.

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Shabba53
post Apr 15 2010, 08:17 PM
Post #18


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The amount of people we've banned in the past several years is about equal to the number of people who left during the great schism, but have started to come around again.

So I like to teach. So what? I'm certainly not the only one at the WS and I'm sure there are a few here too. It's interesting how that can be turned around to me acting high-brow.

I understand. It's for the spectacle. That's OK. I won't take it personally.
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Tibro
post Apr 15 2010, 08:22 PM
Post #19


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Wisdom and education from the man who wrote:

QUOTE
People can run a forum however they so choose. Hypocritical or not. It doesn't matter.


I'm sure there must be a lesson in that somewhere.


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to retain my sanity.

Then I try to convince myself that it is.

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Shabba53
post Apr 15 2010, 08:38 PM
Post #20


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It's true isn't it? If someone owns a forum, they can run it how they choose. That's not to say anything about Gwydion or Oxy or Ben or anyone else. It's just a fact. There's nothing you or I or anyone else can do to change it. They own it. I know you like to distort that by saying it's an admission that I think Gwydion is a hypocrite, but that wasn't my intention, and I'm sure you know that.

But I find it funny that you talk about hypocrisy, when you explained to me that censorship is evil and should never be tolerated, then came back and said it's OK for you to censor yourself at work because it's your job.

I guess censorship's OK if it pays the bills, but the line is drawn there.
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Artemis
post Apr 15 2010, 08:59 PM
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MGS originally posted his question at WWS. I responded and asked him why he didn't post it here. Thank you, MGS for doing so.

I wanted it posted here because I was confident he would get opinions here that he wouldn't get there.

As I explained over there, Under the Bridge wasn't the best place for it (assuming it wasn't moved here from somewhere else, which if it happened was unfortunate because he's not a troll and I think he had only good intentions).


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Absomphe
post Apr 15 2010, 09:57 PM
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QUOTE(Shabba53 @ Apr 15 2010, 11:24 AM) *

But I guess that's where the difference between you and I lies.


For the love of God, Montresor, …me, not I!!! frusty.gif


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Artemis
post Apr 15 2010, 10:01 PM
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I have to say that it's a joke that "the press" avoids this place (or any place that provides solid information). They don't have to comment in the forum, or even reveal that they are here, to glean information. So what's the problem? All the truth anyone needs to know about absinthe has been available here for many years, yet "the press" almost completely continued to ignore absinthe or to publish trash. Members here have every reason to hold "the press" in contempt. In fact, so does everybody else. To hell with "the press".

As to credibility, I would put the credibility of this place with regard to absinthe up against any source, anywhere, any time.


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Jaded Prole
post Apr 15 2010, 10:08 PM
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I'll drink to that!


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A fine absinthe is the product of knowledge, craftsmanship, and talent. An exceptional absinthe is the product of those things plus obsession. Most absinthe is the product of marketing.
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Absomphe
post Apr 15 2010, 10:09 PM
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Beat you to it!


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Tibro
post Apr 15 2010, 11:07 PM
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Shabbutt, I won't contest that the owner of a piece of property may handle their owned bit of propagandist machinery as they choose. But for you to swing your leaden balls around in a professed effort to edumacate the dirty masses, or the prim and proper honor students, or who-the-fuck-ever it may be, and say that any institutional hypocrisy, should it exist, "doesn't matter" is an attitude that should worry anybody seeking the truth. WS has an owner that may or may not be a hypocrite wielding a propaganda tool that he owns and professes to use towards a particular purpose. You, belonging to the inner sanctum of that collection of tools, don't care if it's being wielded honestly or hypocritically. What the fuck do you want us to invest in?


--------------------
When I wake up,
I try to convince myself that my arm
isn't there --
to retain my sanity.

Then I try to convince myself that it is.

Frank Bidart
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Shabba53
post Apr 15 2010, 11:15 PM
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QUOTE(Artemis @ Apr 15 2010, 06:01 PM) *

I have to say that it's a joke that "the press" avoids this place (or any place that provides solid information).
You don't have to agree. But it isn't a joke. I've heard it so many times, I've lost count.

How many times have you seen Fee Verte referenced in an article?

QUOTE
They don't have to comment in the forum, or even reveal that they are here, to glean information. So what's the problem?
The problem is wading through all of the flaming and vitriol. Understand that many journalists are under deadlines and are looking for quick answers. If they have to dig through 3 pages of insults and arguments to find 2 or 3 posts of good information, they'll look somewhere else.

QUOTE
yet "the press" almost completely continued to ignore absinthe or to publish trash.
I can give you pdfs of articles in some of the best publications that are fairly well written and deliver good information to the public. The articles or presentations that aren't well written, are typically done by people who don't do their research. Which underscores the need for a good source of information that provides a comfortable atmosphere for them to get that information.

QUOTE
In fact, so does everybody else. To hell with "the press".
So, do you think that this site has the potential to reach more people than say, an article written in Reuters, or Robb Report, or Denver Post? Which has better potential to inform more people?

QUOTE
As to credibility, I would put the credibility of this place with regard to absinthe up against any source, anywhere, any time.

There is no argument that this site is a vast wealth of knowledge. That wasn't my point. But the credibility most certainly is tainted if a newcomer or researcher ventures into the forums and sees very little substantive discussion anymore. Along with have to sift through all of the negativity, that can definitey leave a bad taste in someone's mouth, and most certainly has.

Just look at the statistics regarding unique visits and even visits by established members. Active discussions have all but disappeared. Most of the people who are major resources don't even post anymore. Do you think that's a coincidence?
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Shabba53
post Apr 15 2010, 11:20 PM
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QUOTE(Tibro @ Apr 15 2010, 07:07 PM) *
WS has an owner that may or may not be a hypocrite wielding a propaganda tool that he owns and professes to use towards a particular purpose.

Propaganda? What purpose are you talking about other than education? And PLEEEEASE don't say it's for his own brand. That argument is so ridiculous, and actually quite hypocritical for you to criticize if that's what you believe.
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Tibro
post Apr 15 2010, 11:25 PM
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Propaganda, as in offering the proper edumacational informations. I didn't say it's a shill site, if that's what you're trying to accuse me of.

And do you think it's a coincidence that banning a few people leads the remaining members to stifle their dissent? If you can slap the leaders and the knowledgeable dissenters the sheep will follow. And bleat according to the Chairman's wishes. At least on his public domain.


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When I wake up,
I try to convince myself that my arm
isn't there --
to retain my sanity.

Then I try to convince myself that it is.

Frank Bidart
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Shabba53
post Apr 15 2010, 11:27 PM
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I'm sure you're smarter than that. If they dissent, they will just go away. They aren't forced to stay on the forum. They won't just continue to stay. There are too many other places they can go. That's a ridiculous argument.

So again, what's the propaganda?
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