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The Fée Verte Absinthe Forum - The Oldest, Largest, Most Authoritative Absinthe Forum. > The Monkey Hole > Arts & Philosphical Sundries
Moloch
How much does humanity know compared to how much there is to know?
How much of what we think we know is actually wrong?

Every year there are new discoveries that "prove" an age old belief wrong.
For thousands of years the earth was believed to be flat (and supposedly still is by some).
Until the mid 1900's scientists believed humans to have been around for only thousands of years, now we believe millions of years.

And what about the chicken egg?
One year they are good for you, the next they are bad, then they are good for you again…

Please discuss.
Fredie
Chickens aren't the only animals who lay or have eggs….

and an egg is just a cell to begin with anyway…..

so in that regard….most living things have eggs….

and a lot of those creatures were here way before chickens ever evovled…..

So this old question is easily answered…..

The egg came first…… with it, there could never have been a chicken in the first place. harhar.gif
Hiram
He wasn't asking which came first. PTFA.
AndrewT
I think he was referring the benefits vs. dangers of regularly eating chicken eggs, not which came first harhar.gif

As far as how much we know vs. how much there is to know, think of it this way-

We can hardly say we know everything about the planet we live on. It doesn't matter whether we know 99% or .001%, because our planet makes up an infinitely small percentage of what we know exists, and what we know exists is most likely an infinitely small percentage of what actually exists.

As for whether what we "know" is actually the truth is an unanswerable question. We cannot perceive reality directly, and must rely on our senses to give us 5 different aspects of it. The distinction of "true" and "false" don't exist outside of our minds. The flat earth vs. round earth debate, likewise, is irrelevent outside of the human mind because "round" and "flat" are just generalizations we use for comparrison. The current measurements show that Earth is a squashed sphere (i.e. the equator is slightly longer than the prime meridian) and is smoother than a billiard ball, despite some fairly impressive mountains. Does that count as "round"? I suppose. But humans will never be able to completely conceptualize the entirety of the Earth, so we generalize it. The same is true for all things that we "know", and every once in a while we realize that old generalizations don't stand up to new information.

Phew, enough of that. Haven't had a good philosophical rant in a while, though. Thanks for bringing it up abs-cheers.gif
Selmac
[The egg came first…… with it, there could never have been a chicken in the first place.]

Unless the chicken was intelligently designed…..
Fredie
…it was not. Otherwise it would do this…. evill.gif
Moloch
I agree with most of what Andrew wrote, its hard to say if what we currently believe as truth really is true. There are always new things that change the "truth" of what we know.

I have been doing some reading lately about Edgar Cayce, who is considered to be the greatest psychic of the 20th century. He claims that the information he recieved comes from the akashic records (God's book of remembrance, the book of life). This is supposed to be a storehouse of all information of every soul that has ever existed.

QUOTE (AndrewT @ Sep 11 2005, 09:43 PM)
As for whether what we "know" is actually the truth is an unanswerable question.

Cayce has predicted that someday a device will be made that will be able to read the akashic records directly, thus granting all information to whomever controls such a device.

As interesting as this might seem, I think knowing the truth about everything would destroy society.
AndrewT
Well not everything that is knowable is a fact. For example, I know that if I use my arms to manipulate certain musical instruments in the right way, I can make some pretty nice sounds. However, how to do that is the kind of knowledge that takes years and years of experience to gain. And I think that's the kind of knowledge that really makes life worth living.
Moloch
Cheers to that. abs-cheers.gif
Grim
QUOTE (AndrewT @ Sep 12 2005, 06:52 PM)
Well not everything that is knowable is a fact. For example, I know that if I use my arms to manipulate certain musical instruments in the right way, I can make some pretty nice sounds. However, how to do that is the kind of knowledge that takes years and years of experience to gain. And I think that's the kind of knowledge that really makes life worth living.

And it only takes a night of good hooch for your talent to fall right out of your ass.

HAAAAAA!
Grim
Don't tell me I'm lie'n either, I've seen you xitfaced 'til your eyes crossed, n' drool all over your frontside. Fuckin' lightweight. wink.gif
AndrewT
Thus is the wonder of ethanol. abs-cheers.gif
jacal01
I've crossed a few eyes and dotted a few tees myself lately, Andrew, so all's I've got to say is we'll both be there when grimster gets his one fine day.

No matter how much he practices.
Grim
I don't pass out, I recharge for anti-rest.
Gordon
Yea, right! harhar.gif
la mort tchèque
"A chicken is a device which an egg uses to make another egg."
Grim
Makes ya think, aren't genes selfish?!
Donnie Darko
QUOTE (AndrewT @ Sep 11 2005, 06:43 PM)
I think he was referring the benefits vs. dangers of regularly eating chicken eggs, not which came first

What we've learned is that the answer depends heavily on genetic variables. I eat eggs everyday and my cholesterol is lower than most vegetarians. If my uncle did the same thing his would be through the roof.

The more I learn, the more I'm really beginning to realize that HOW we learn is just as important as WHAT we learn. The books that really convinced me of that are The Tao of Physics by Fritjof Capra and Chaos by James Gleick. Both of them do a great job of getting you to think in the nooks and crannies that normal didactic texts overlook, and it seems to be those overlooked places where the most important connections can be found.
jacal01
I'm beginning to learn that the most important thing is just being receptive to learning.

Evidently, steadfast opinions can be formed in the complete absence of depth of knowledge in the subject matter, if one fancies oneself an authority.
Donnie Darko
Evidently?

I don't know much, but I do know that being passive aggressive accomplishes nothing.
jacal01
Not sure passive aggressive tendencies characterize this particular pervasive behavior. More like the smug certainty of ignorance and belligerence to all knowledge that might assail that bastion of arbitrary belief.
Grim
It tain't whatcha say, it's the way thatcha say it.
Donnie Darko
I don't know.

hartsmar
I think it's all pretty simple. I know what I know and that's what I know.

You know…
Gertz
The only thing I know is that I don't know anything. Or at least I think so.
jacal01
The trick is to know that you don’t know and not substitute it with something you think you know because you’ve divined a knowing.

But Grimdel has the right of it, it’s not whether or not you do know, but convincing other unknowing people that you know.
Donnie Darko
How do you know?
jacal01
By the old axiom that the more you know, the more you realize that you don’t know.

You know?
grey boy
No.
Kirk
You don't need to know a whole lot,
mainly you need to know where to find the answer when you need it,
the rest of the time we coast.
jacal01
You also need to recognize the need to research it open-mindedly, and not just hypothesize it and maybe look it up only to the extent of buttressing your predilection and subsequently own it against all comers.

Choice of reference material also makes a difference.
Grim
viking_emoticon.gif PM sent.
Exquisite_Mischief
I love Edgar Cayce.. as for truth, I believe there is an element of truth in everything, and that truth is somewhat relative, I believe in a collective consciousness, and that energy lives on after physical death.. so in that way it to some extent parallels what you mentioned in reference to Cayce/akashic records.

Heidegger (one of my favourite philosophers) spoke of the poets role in a destitute time (ie what he considered to be the time we currently live in - a time when the aesthetics of life are replaced with what I like to refer to as "microwave mentality") .. to Heidegger the poets role in a destitute time is to look into the abyss.. to shed light.. the abyss being a crack in "being", what we are grounded upon.. then to me, truth is constantly and consistently revealed, as each "poet" sheds light into the abyss.. it is added upon by each further enlightenment. Irrelevant that what were at one time considered "truths" which we have now realized were not accurate.. essentially what was revealed at that time, made it possible for the next "poet" to shed further light into the abyss, and to lead us beyond what had already been disclosed.

- Exquisite Mischief





QUOTE(Moloch @ Sep 12 2005, 06:36 PM) *

I agree with most of what Andrew wrote, its hard to say if what we currently believe as truth really is true. There are always new things that change the "truth" of what we know.

I have been doing some reading lately about Edgar Cayce, who is considered to be the greatest psychic of the 20th century. He claims that the information he recieved comes from the akashic records (God's book of remembrance, the book of life). This is supposed to be a storehouse of all information of every soul that has ever existed.
Cayce has predicted that someday a device will be made that will be able to read the akashic records directly, thus granting all information to whomever controls such a device.

As interesting as this might seem, I think knowing the truth about everything would destroy society.

justabob
QUOTE(la mort tchèque @ Sep 14 2005, 12:01 AM) *

"A chicken is a device which an egg uses to make another egg."


Roosters lay chickens and chickens lay eggs.

The main thing you gonna find you need, is a fertile place to plant your seed.
evolution
Truth is subjective, not objective…except in mathematics.

One never experiences the exact same glass of absinthe. You never have the exact amount of water. The sugar cube may be somewhat different than the last. Etc.

and the egg came first.

Exquisite_Mischief
QUOTE(evolution @ Nov 12 2005, 11:04 PM) *

Truth is subjective, not objective…except in mathematics.

One never experiences the exact same glass of absinthe. You never have the exact amount of water. The sugar cube may be somewhat different than the last. Etc.

and the egg came first.


In agreement, and said very eloquently.

sunsetbrew
QUOTE(evolution @ Nov 12 2005, 10:04 PM) *

…except in mathematics.


Actually this is not exactly true. Don't mean to be picky as it does not make a difference to your point.
evolution
QUOTE(sunsetbrew @ Nov 13 2005, 01:30 AM) *

Actually this is not exactly true. Don't mean to be picky as it does not make a difference to your point.


ya….you're right. forgive me, I ran out of absinthe and Im drinking martinis tonight. the buzz is there, but the head isn't as clear.
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