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Fredie
Come on you raver....You Seer of visions....
Come on you painter...You piper.... You prisoner.....
and shine.........!”
IPB Image
1946-2006
chefpunk
I heard about diabetes, but they hadn't said the cause of death.
-the lunatic is in my head! w00t2.gif

R.I.P. Syd
Fredie
Syd's not Dead!
He's just gone off to study Astronomy with Domine!
chefpunk
poke.gif
chefpunk
Anyone heard the new floyd?
Fredie
Do you mean David Gilmour's latest album?
chefpunk
Err...I guess.
Thought it was a Floyd thing?
Pulse right?
Fredie
Oh,the DVD..... isn't it just the DVD release of the Pulse concert from 10 years ago? blink.gif

Come on you boy child,,,,,, you winner and loser, come
on you miner for truth and delusion,,,,,,,,and shine!
chefpunk
Now we are parked in the same garage.
Didn't know D.G. had a new one though, how is it?
Fredie
Well.... it's no Madcap laughs!!!! frusty.gif

It's very good.... If you like the post waters floyd albums it's somewhere between those and about face.


Come on you target for faraway laughter, come on you stranger, you legend, you martyr, and shine!
chefpunk
Guess the tour rumor was B.S.

chefpunk
Don't know that much about Barret.
Just that he was a highly influencial.
David Bowie, trent reznor, ect. all took to his thing.
And that the wall was all about him.
Pretty tragic story.
Fredie
Well.... Wish you were here was about him.....
The Wall was more about Roger's dad and his own alienation....
though there's no doubt that Syd was in there too somewhere. frusty.gif
Absomphe
Syd, we hardly knew ye... bye1.gif
Jack Batemaster
Who the fuck is Std Bearit?
G&C
He had a bike
You could ride it if you like. . .
hartsmar
So... Where's that Elvis dude?
Marc
QUOTE(Jack Batemaster @ Jul 12 2006, 02:00 AM) *

Who the fuck is Std Bearit?


The former member of The Stooges

Now I wanna be your dog
Well C'mon
eric
http://www.slate.com/id/2145531/?GT1=8391

obit: Bringing out the dead.
Pink Void
The psychedelic legacy of Syd Barrett.
By Jody Rosen
Posted Tuesday, July 11, 2006, at 6:12 PM ET
Syd Barrett, who died several days ago (no one is sure exactly when) at age 60, was, to say the least, a mess. The wire services are remembering the co-founder and first lead singer of Pink Floyd as a "troubled genius"—obit-speak for lunatic—and indeed his life was a lurid tragedy that seemed scripted for a VH-1 Behind the Music special: Gifted psychedelic-rock pioneer streaks like a comet across the Swinging London music scene, sears his mind on drugs, descends into madness, and disappears. He became something more horrifying than a rock martyr like Jim Morrison or Jimi Hendrix; he became a kind of living dead man. The most famous episode in the Barrett legend was his 1975 reunion with Pink Floyd, when he turned up unannounced at Abbey Road Studios just as the band was recording their Barrett elegy, "Shine On, You Crazy Diamond." He was a gruesome apparition—bloated, with a shaved head and shaved eyebrows—and none of his ex-bandmates recognized him.

And yet this epic mess of a man made art that was anything but. Listening to Barrett's songs—to the first Pink Floyd singles, to the band's 1967 debut The Piper at the Gates of Dawn, and to Barrett's early '70s solo records—one is struck by the formal rigor, the wit, the satisfying symmetries of his music and words. Barrett was a terrific craftsman, and neither the dissonance and clatter of his soundscapes nor the cheery freakiness of his lyrics could hide the songs' essential classicism. Had Barrett been born 30 years earlier, and done several thousand fewer hits of LSD, he could have made a fine living on Tin Pan Alley. The Piper at the Gates of Dawn is probably the great '60s psychedelic rock album, and it reminds us that psychedelic rock wasn't an atonal maelstrom, but pop gone a little fuzzy and acid-fried around the edges: catchy songs tricked out with weird noises. Barrett's lyrics similarly mixed old-fashioned rigor with drug-fueled surreality, nonsense with wry, funny, haunting sense. "Arnold Layne," Pink Floyd's first single, sounds like doggerel, but listen closer and you hear the tale of a transvestite who steals his wardrobe from clotheslines: "Arnold Layne/ Had a strange hobby/ Collecting clothes/ Moonshine, washing line/ They suit him fine."

Barrett delivers those lines in a nasal southern English whine, which was something of an innovation for the time. Most British bands, including the Stones and early Beatles, sang in ersatz-American accents, but Barrett proclaimed his Englishness and not just by refusing to Yankee-up his singing voice. His songs are steeped in a pastoral fairy-tale Englishness—enchanted forests and gnomes in tunics and mice romping through barley fields—which is what you get, I guess, when you mix hard drugs with Victorian children's literature. (Barrett took the phrase "piper at the gates of dawn" from Kenneth Grahame's Wind in the Willows.) It's a deeply quaint and provincial worldview, perfect for Barrett's twisty little pop songs but miles from the space-rock grandeur that Pink Floyd would achieve on post-Barrett classics like Dark Side of the Moon. Rock snobs like to say that Pink Floyd lost it when Barrett freaked out and left the band, but the truth is Floyd would probably have gone down in history as a curio had Barrett stuck around—and what's more, there wouldn't be any such thing as Radiohead.

For decades, Barrett was rock's great romantic-tragic recluse, and now that there will definitely be no second act to his sad story, the Byronic myth surrounding him is bound to inflate. (I'm sure we'll be hearing lots of his 1970 ballad "Dark Globe," a terrifying farewell from a man slipping into madness: "Please, please, please lift the hand/ I'm only a person with Eskimo chain/ I tattooed my brain all the way/ Won't you miss me?/ Wouldn't you miss me at all?"*) But it would be nice if Barrett was recalled not just as an acid casualty or as a legendary "rock madman" but as an English eccentric in the surreal-comic tradition that extends from Lewis Carroll to Monty Python and, via Barrett, onto the weirdo-pop specialist Robyn Hitchcock. Barrett spent his final years in his mother's house in Cambridge, England, living comfortably off the royalties that his former bandmates made sure he collected. Reportedly, his pastimes were painting and gardening, and he was often seen by neighbors on his bicycle. It sounds like a pretty nice life, actually, and it's pleasant to think of Barrett ending his days as a vaguely Victorian figure—an odd old Englishman who'd made quite a splash in his youth, tottering through town on two wheels.

Correction, July 12: The article originally misquoted the lyrics of "Dark Globe." (Return to the corrected sentence.)


Jody Rosen is Slate's music critic. He lives in New York City. He can be reached at slatemusic@gmail.com.
Absomphe
Great perspective/retrospective of a true one-of-a-kind artist.

Thanks, Eric.
Artemis
"But it would be nice if Barrett was recalled not just as an acid casualty ..."

A good place to start would be to refrain from designating him as such several times in an article as this hypocrite has just done. He was almost certainly schizophrenic. Acid didn't do that to him. "The media" is full of a story in the last few days about a recent psilocybin study that had beneficial results for a number of people. That was well-proven by any number of studies forty and more years ago, before Timothy Leary was proclaimed public enemy number one. Imagine what would happen if absinthe were to be studied ...
Selmac
What Artemis said. As far as I know, there is no concrete evidence that LSD causes permanent psychosis.
Nymphadora
My advice to people today is as follows: If you take the game of life seriously, if you take your nervous system seriously, if you take your sense organs seriously, if you take the energy process seriously, you must turn on, tune in, and drop out.

-- Timothy Leary


Actually, my first introduction to Mr. Leary was the weird, old guy in Devo videos.
Donnie Darko
Arty is right. Having known a couple of Schizophrenics and having lived with one briefly, I'm also convinced Barrett was Schizophrenic. His acid regimen was likely self-medication.

QUOTE
Reportedly, his pastimes were painting and gardening, and he was often seen by neighbors on his bicycle. It sounds like a pretty nice life,


Living with your mom, painting and gardening is a nice life for an 11 year old. It's too bad Barrett didn't get the treatment he needed, he could have contributed much more to music, as he clearly had a lot of talent.
Mashoujiki
Wrong. There is indeed evidence that at the very least, LSD can act as a catalyst to help a borderline psychosis reach fruition and having witnessed some pretty intense psychoses as a result of it myself I can confirm this if nothing else. It's quite possibly my favorite recreational drug, but let's not for a second think that home experiments in brain chemistry isn't EXTREMELY dangerous and can have SERIOUS and permanent repercussions. Whether that was Mr. Barret's issue I dare not hazard a guess, but it is a definate possiblity.
Donnie Darko
Oh, I'm sure large enough doses of acid can cause permanent brain problems, as I've met a few people who took so much LSD at one time years ago that they're only half there now. Only Selmac said LSD didn't cause permanent brain damage, which I disagree with. I'm simply saying that Barrett was already mentally ill, the drugs were a symptom, not a cause. Take enough of any seratonin releasing drug and you'll lose your shit down the road, but pretty much everyone describes him as not being entirely functional from the get go, so I doubt the drugs did anything other than maybe slightly accelerate his already in-progress mental problems.
Fredie
QUOTE(eric @ Jul 12 2006, 10:45 AM) *




Posted Tuesday, July 11, 2006, at 6:12 PM ET
Syd Barrett, who died several days ago (no one is sure exactly when)


It was July 7
Selmac
For the record, I did not say categorically that LSD causes no permanent brain damage. I simply have not seen evidence beyond the anecdotal.
Artemis
Read and learn. Like I said, controlled scientific experiments with these drugs are nothing new. Leary, Alpert, and many others carried out tons of these forty or more years ago, before government-fueled paranoia and direct jackbooted interference put scientists in the position of risking their careers, if not their freedom, by experimenting in that vein. LSD, psilocybin, and mescaline were first thought to have great promise in the TREATMENT of psychosis, and many experiments confirmed that they live up to the promise. Unlike you, I'm not aware of a single objective account of LSD causing any "brain damage" whatsoever - as far as I know, the "evidence" for such is entirely anecdotal. Do we see a familiar story here? Once were absintheurs ...

By read for evidence other than anecdotal, I meant for evidence of these drugs having promise as medications. It seems to me that to proove they make you crazy, you'd have to set out to make people crazy with them, and make sure they didn't get crazy some other way. That's obviously not going to happen. The fact that some people who took LSD in whatever amount went crazy means nothing. It could mean that people whose minds tend to work differently than "normal" tend to do things like try mind-bending drugs AND coincidentally, to also go crazy, for all we know.
Donnie Darko
Every anecdotal incident I've seen when someone "permadosed" themselves (one guy ate a sheet so the cops chasing him couldn't find it on him) was after the fact. I never knew the person before they were crazy, so it's entirely possible they were crazy before they took the quantity that supposedly melted their brain. You'd HAVE to already be crazy to eat a sheet of LSD anyway.

If there's anything in hallucinogens which MIGHT cause brain damage, it would be the excessive amount of seratonin they cause your brain to dump, which some people believe burns out your Seratonin receptors and could lead to manic depression later on. There's no studies proving that though, nobody knows for certain, it's just a guess. So I guess I'm not so sure that it causes brain damage, but I think it's possible that it could. I did enough of the stuff when I was younger, so maybe I'll find out one day, though I've noticed no ill effects thus far. The other issue is adulterants added to the drug, or the drug being made incorrectly, which might have detrimental effects the pure drug doesn't (DMA is easier to manufacture than MDMA and is often sold as MDMA, but more dangerous). Anecdotally, because one can't control the purity of the drug, there's no way to tell if it was the drug or an adulterant that caused any perceivable damage.

Anecdotal evidence goes both ways anyway. Having seen interviews with Dr. Albert Hoffman, who turned 100 recently, he seemed pretty lucid to me, especially for being 100, and he certainly took enough LSD, and it was always pure because he made it.
Mashoujiki
I don't know about "brain damage" but I do know that everytime I go on a hallucinogenic trip I almost always bring something back with me, in a manner of speaking. I think it has something to do with myelination of pathways that don't normally get fired, and there's also just plain ol' psyche cracking that comes from extremely traumatic experiences like a bad trip. High dose trips can be terribly frightening and the ego shattering experience imo can be too much to handle for some. I highly doubt, however, they will ever find any concrete evidence of actual damage to the brain as caused by LSD or psilocybes.
Donnie Darko
I never gained much from my hallucinogenic experiences, although it was interesting to personally experience temporary insanity. It can give one a greater understanding of how many mental illnesses really are just brain malfunctions. Somebody should put LSD in Scientologist's water supply. They're already crazy anyway, it won't hurt them.

Mostly I found that hallucinogens had a greater potential to annoy me than to entertain me. For alternate realities, I prefer video games. That way I can experience an alternate reality while keeping my own identity and emotional response mechanisms in check. With LSD, no matter how many times you tell yourself it's just a hallucination, your brain won't let go of whatever is stimulating it, and you have no choice but to submit to your own dementia.
verawench
Syd wasn't an "acid casualty", he was mentally ill. Enjoy your great gig in the sky, man.

On a somewhat related topic, I like this idea: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/4877462.stm
Artemis
Well, Albert Hoffman, who first created LSD, did God's work as far as I'm concerned. That's a fascinating story - he was trying to find a cure for headache, and he had tested LSD molecules (I guess that's the right word) and he had numbered them - he was way past number 25, then one day for some reason he felt compelled to test number 25 again - he took what he supposed to be a miniscule dose - it was actually, for LSD, quite a hefty dose. He then tried to ride a bicycle home, and if you've ever taken LSD, you can imagine the fun (or was it hell) that entailed ... my nephew tried the same thing one day about 30 years ago, after a substantial serving of Psilocybe Cubensis - he rode right past his house, and all tied into the pedalling and nothing but the pedalling realized he had ridden five miles past his house before he sized up his situation rationally.

I once read some speculation that this "rewiring" of the brain that LSD does, producing a temporary enlightenment, might well ruin whatever chance a person might have of achieving a permanent state, such as is engendered by Zen or more traditional disciplines of that sort. That's what warned me off LSD and the like. Well that, and being subjected to drug tests ....

I recently learned that Aleister Crowley was heavy into "Anhalonium" (mescaline), which puts into doubt the things he achieved in magickal rituals, if there was any credence in that in the first place.
Jack Batemaster
I wish I had a xeet to eat...
Jaded Prole
Then eat xeet!

I don't think having been exposed to LSD would preclude enlightenment but I don't think it is ever truly a permanent state, at least not while your alive.
Artemis
I should have said a sustained state in this lifetime, as opposed to the passing glory that is an LSD experience (if you're lucky).
Selmac
As I understand it, a drug test that detects LSD is pretty uncommon and expensive.

Artemis, if you can remember off the top of your head where you read about LSD as it relates to (or detracts from) a more permanent state of enlightenment, I would love to read about it.

Speaking of mescaline, if you think Czechsinthes are vile you should try eating a peyote cactus. That flavor sticks with you for days.
Gertz
QUOTE(Selmac @ Jul 19 2006, 01:21 AM) *
Artemis, if you can remember off the top of your head where you read about LSD as it relates to (or detracts from) a more permanent state of enlightenment, I would love to read about it.

I've read something along the same line, but that was in a now out-of-print book that exists in danish only, so that'd probably not be of much help.

The point was that what LSD does to your brain is basically the same that happens in a mystical/religious experience. The difference is that LSD blows all the gates open to everything, while the mystic takes one step at a time and only goes as far as the current wiring of his/her neurones allows. LSD would sort of bypass the way things are supposed to be done. It's like being dumped right there instead of doing the journey and answering the riddle of the Sphinx or whatever you're supposed to do.
G&C
Why waste time.

Life's too short.

Take the short cut to the end game!
Absomphe
Who's the Louis Pasteur-lookin' chap, G&C?
G&C
He's an old dead French dude.

He made me swear never to give up his identity.
Absomphe
I figgered he looked like a Witness Protection Program type.

I'll just think of him as Louis.
Donnie Darko
QUOTE(Gertz @ Jul 19 2006, 05:17 AM) *

The point was that what LSD does to your brain is basically the same that happens in a mystical/religious experience. The difference is that LSD blows all the gates open to everything, while the mystic takes one step at a time and only goes as far as the current wiring of his/her neurones allows. LSD would sort of bypass the way things are supposed to be done. It's like being dumped right there instead of doing the journey and answering the riddle of the Sphinx or whatever you're supposed to do.


This subject reminds me of Homer Simpson eating those hallucinogenic chili peppers in the Pope of Chili Town episode.

Here's the issue I have with all this mysticism/LSD stuff. When David Blaine levitates, he's not actually levitating. When you take acid or meditate on a mountain in Tibet or whatever, it's not magic either. It's a self-absorbed illusory experience in which you're attempting to alter your perception of the world, rejecting the reality in front of you and substituting your own. It might be a very convincing experience, but it's more in your head than not. Illusory experiences can teach us some things about the real world and our own malleable perception of it, but I think treating that altered state of perception as an end in itself is imbalanced. And if you get sucked far enough into your own head, it borders on mental illness. Ken Russel's movie "Altered States", while being dated and fucking weird, IMO does a good job of showing the dangers of trying to transcend the reality in front of you. David Cronenberg's ExistenZ is another one.

Sometimes it's important to take time out from worldly activities and go inside your head and sort things out. Nothing wrong with that, as long as it's in moderation. If you do it all the time though, I'd say that qualifies as being nuts.
Like Syd Barrett.
Kirk
I agree.
While hallucinogenics can alter your perception, even making ordinary things seem extraordinary
it is still the effect of a drug.
Zen is an ordinary thing that becomes extraordinary. By accepting the rightness or beauty of an ordinary object you gain insight into the nature of reality.
Play with the cards you got, you'll get better ones.
Jack Batemaster
G&C's avatar is actually David Blaine who went back in time to France and completely changed his appearance by using some trippy assed majik xit...
Artemis
"Artemis, if you can remember off the top of your head where you read about LSD as it relates to (or detracts from) a more permanent state of enlightenment, I would love to read about it."

I don't remember. It was a long time ago, when I was reading everything I could get my hands on about Zen (anything from Christopher Isherwood to Alan Watts to Blyth to D.T Suzuki) as well as everything about the work of Hoffman, Leary, Alpert, etc. and Aldous Huxley. It could have been in any of those books. Zen properly understood is a re-wiring of re-programming of the brain - LSD does the same thing, but all in a rush, as someone just pointed out. If I had to guess, I'd say it was Suzuki who wrote that - he had a more scientific outlook than any other Eastern writer on the subject.
Jaded Prole
Zen or other forms of meditation may heighten awareness but I think it is no way comparible to the effects of LSD. One may achieve moments of enlightenment and wisdom through meditation and conscious living weather one has dropped acid in the past or not.

The experience of LSD or similar substances makes one aware of the relativity and range of consciousness and sensory observation and may entail some internal psychological exploration but I don't think this is synonymous with spiritual enlightenment. It may or may not lead one in that direction. I think the experience of taking LSD (if one can find untainted stuff) has value but I agree that it is not something to make a habit of doing.
Donnie Darko
QUOTE(Jaded Prol @ Jul 19 2006, 05:02 PM) *

but I don't think this is synonymous with spiritual enlightenment.


I'm skeptical about the existence of such a thing as spiritual enlightenment. I always understood "spiritual enlightenment" in the Eastern Mysticism sense of the word to be a perpetual state of blissful perfection which only occurs if one stops obeying worldly desires. By abandoning worldly desire, I think one becomes imbalanced and only part human. I do believe that nature has a Way, a Tao, or whatever you want to call its system of checks and balances that keeps it moving, but many ways to enlightenment I've heard of seems to contradict that natural push/pull yin/yang thing that is nature. There are some very wise writings out there on the subject, and I agree with a lot of them, but I don't understand this whole quest for "enlightenment". Seems like just a more abstract quest for "Heaven", whatever that is.

This is just my observation, I may be 100% wrong, but "spiritual enlightenment" just doesn't seem all that special to me.
traineraz
The lesson I've learned from assorted Buddhist writings is the relinquishment of attachment to desires. That is, there's nothing wrong if you want something, or enjoy something, as long as you also realize that it's a temporary pleasure. Or a temporary problem, if your desire is for something to stop. And everything is temporary, cuz it's all gonna stop someday. <splat>

This can lead to a far greater enjoyment of everyday occurrences -- being happy and being in the moment -- rather than focusing on achieving that one great thing that will make you happy.

Or not.
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