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Marc
Here it is:

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Don't ask me where to get it online, I bought mine in Chapon's store in Pontarlier.
Tibro
Are we allowed to ask your opinion of the flavor? And the price?
Marc
Not yet, I tasted it several time and found it very good but that was during festivals, I need to taste it again quietly at home.
I just remember a perfumed and floral fennel/wormwood combination up front.

As for the price, let's wait a little.
absinthist
Looks nice, especially the design and it is good that finally the word "extrait" is used on the label and is more visible than these EU-forced contradictory terms.

Maybe, some pics of louche-action, Socky?
Wild Bill Turkey
Oh to see photographs of Guy's facial expression. O happy day that has such moments in it.


What if he was drinking a glass of milk when he heard?
The Standard Deviant
The horror. . . Most French people only have UHT.

Bog milk: the ‘Aux extraits de plantes d'absinthe’ is a French regulation, not the EU.
absinthist
Yes, but France is part of the EU, and EU held the full responsibility for any stupid labels/definitions they are givin' any reputable spirit and/or spirit-drink. And it took them 20 years to actually define spirits that had had their proper, correct names long before.

However, "Extrait aux plantes aromatiques" sounds much better and fuller than "spiritueux au base aux extrait de plantes d'absinthes" (the longest I happen to have seen somewhere, and hence, the most stupid).
Jaded Prole
No eucalyptus notes?
Marc
Not that I remember.
Absomphe
Fisherman's Friend™!

You nailed it, Prol, that's what it was that I found disturbing about the old Doubs.
Marc
Too bad the Doubs was not entered in the competition
Oxygenee
I'd hoped to hold off on a formal announcement for a little longer - because the product is not yet available online - but it seems the cat is out of the bag.

A few notes:

1. The final name for the new product will be Absinthe Mystique, and it's under that name that it will be sold online. The word Doubs is included on the label as an interim measure, for the purposes of smoothing the changeover from the old version to the new, but will be phased out.

2. The new product is not an "improved" or "tweaked" version of the old Doubs, it's an entirely new product. It's fully distilled and naturally chlorophylically coloured. It's produced and bottled at the Pernot distillery in Pontarlier. It's 65% alcohol.

3. My aim in formulating and distilling it was simple: I wanted to make, absolutely without regard to cost or technical difficulties, the finest, most complex, most delicious absinthe I could. How well I've succeeded will be up to you all as consumers to judge. It's not, unlike the Jades and the 1797 we'll shortly be releasing, an historical-recreation absinthe. It's a modern absinthe, although one that pays hommage to the recipes and methods of the past. No other modern absinthe has - to the best of my knowledge - as complex a herb bill - the 11 herbs mentioned on the label should be read as "at least 11"…..

4. All the herbs - including of course the grande absinthe - that could be sourced from the Pontarlier region were sourced locally. Enormous effort was expended on herb selection, and preparation. The youngest distillations in the final blend are at least 6 months old, the oldest more than a year old, and this balance will be maintained in future production.

5. It will shortly be available from both Absinthe Classics and LDF (likely in around a fortnight). It's already on retail sale in France.

I'll have further information and detailed pictures in my next newsletter, due out in the next few days.
Jaded Prole
Sounds good, I really look forward to trying it.
Tibro
I hope, like Elvis Costello, your aim is true. I, too, look forward to trying it.
Alice the absinthe eater
Is Mystique going to be released on the U.S. market?
Wild Bill Turkey
QUOTE(Oxygenee @ Oct 10 2007, 10:27 AM) *

The word Doubs is included on the label as an interim measure, for the purposes of smoothing the changeover from the old version to the new

And maybe, just a little, for the purpose of causing Guy to puke up his liver when he saw it for the first time?
Provenance
QUOTE(mthuilli @ Oct 9 2007, 12:54 AM) *

As for the price, let's wait a little.

At a $1.41 per Euro, Mr. Bernanke will make Oxy cry.
traineraz
Running with that thought . . . would it be cost-effective for a European distiller to contract with an American bottler/distributor, and ship bulk product to the US for bottling?

I'm guessing (yes, guessing) that there'd be no real impact on tax, but surely it'd reduce trans-Atlantic shipping cost.
The Standard Deviant
It's probably not large scale enough to make that much difference.
Conte d'Ugenta
QUOTE(Wild Bill Turkey @ Oct 10 2007, 01:34 PM) *

QUOTE(Oxygenee @ Oct 10 2007, 10:27 AM) *

The word Doubs is included on the label as an interim measure, for the purposes of smoothing the changeover from the old version to the new

And maybe, just a little, for the purpose of causing Guy to puke up his liver when he saw it for the first time?



That would be enough to keep the word "Doubs" on the label forever!


Btw pretty nice absinthe, fresh taste and good colour.


wooperman
11? How did you break the code?????

+The original handwritten recipe is purportedly locked in a vault in Louisville, Kentucky.
+Two separate suppliers of seasonings each provide only parts of the recipe, and do not know each other's identity.
+The spices are then later blended by machine at KFC's own commissaries, both to ensure standardization and to ensure that neither company has the complete recipe.
+The few people who do know the recipe are subject to a strict confidentiality agreement.
Click to view attachment



Marc
LOL
I can't stop
LOL
LOL
LOL
LOL





traineraz
headbonk.gif

Betterer?
Marc
Betterer™ indeed!

Butt next time don't stop me from LOLing at his jokes.
Oxygenee
QUOTE(wooperman @ Oct 16 2007, 04:27 AM) *

11? How did you break the code?????

+The original handwritten recipe is purportedly locked in a vault in Louisville, Kentucky.
+Two separate suppliers of seasonings each provide only parts of the recipe, and do not know each other's identity.
+The spices are then later blended by machine at KFC's own commissaries, both to ensure standardization and to ensure that neither company has the complete recipe.
+The few people who do know the recipe are subject to a strict confidentiality agreement.



All pretty much accurate.

PS: Our new Family Thirstbusta Supasize Doubs will come with a free 1 litre Pepsi, and BOTH fries AND mash. How's Jade ever going to compete with THAT????
Steve
What a difference an "e" makes! From Markus:
IPB Image
Austrian Absinthecocktail
0.7 Litre - 18% vol. Alcohol
Reduced from 18,00 €
now only 11,00 €
Absomphe
So, Oxy…

Do you think the Mystique could be the first modern absinthe to compare favorably with some of the better Belle Epoque examples?

Steve
I drank a lot of absinthe during Kallistifest, and the Mystique was definitely my second favorite.

Oh yeah, my favorite was the 1914 Pernod Fils.
Absomphe
Nice!
Steve
Of course, we had to lick it up off the carpet in Oxy's room, but still…
Absomphe
I hear the right carpet shampoo can really round out the flavor of a fine absinthe, although it's a bit of a cheat.

Still, I imagine the stuff's not half-bad on its own merit…the Mystique, I mean. evill.gif
Provenance
QUOTE

we wanted to make, absolutely without regard to
cost or technical difficulties
, the finest, most complex, most
delicious absinthe possible.

QUOTE

excellent as Eric's absinthe was, it wouldn't be financially or practically viable to repeat the exercise.

…™
Marc
Don't make Bunny cry.
Please don't.
G&C
I hope he drowns in his tears.
hartsmar
QUOTE(Provenance @ Oct 25 2007, 11:13 AM) *

QUOTE

we wanted to make, absolutely without regard to
cost or technical difficulties
, the finest, most complex, most
delicious absinthe possible.

QUOTE

excellent as Eric's absinthe was, it wouldn't be financially or practically viable to repeat the exercise.

…™


That really has nothing to do with each other and I'm sure plenty of people are well aware of that.
Oxygenee
QUOTE(mthuilli @ Oct 25 2007, 10:19 PM) *

Don't make Bunny cry.
Please don't.


Too late.
Oxygenee
Eric's absinthe is sui generis. It was superb, but it's not possible to scale his methods from a hundred litres to many thousands of litres. The fact that this is a great pity, doesn't make it any less true.

The Mystique is made to stand on its own merits, not to compete with anything. Some of you will like it, some of you won't. Plus ça change….
Oxygenee
QUOTE(Absomphe @ Oct 17 2007, 05:47 PM) *

So, Oxy…

Do you think the Mystique could be the first modern absinthe to compare favorably with some of the better Belle Epoque examples?



I don't think any modern absinthe tastes as good as the very best Belle Epoque absinthes. But I like the taste of a century's undisturbed maturation in a cool dark celar, which is tricky to duplicate in like, ya know, 6 months.

For what it's worth, I also prefer '47 Cheval Blanc and '21 Yquem to any of the stuff winemakers make these days.
Jaded Prole
And you think I'm an elitist!

I look forward to trying the Mystique.
Absomphe
QUOTE(Oxygenee @ Oct 26 2007, 03:58 AM) *


Yquem


What Prol said!

Sounds like Greek Latin to me, and I've certainly never tried any.

You bon vivant, you. abs-cheers.gif
Donnie Darko
After reading that New Yorker article about Hardy Rodenstock, I'm not sure if many people have had a '21 Yquem.
Oxygenee
The New Yorker article was a hatchet job on Rodenstock.
Kirk
QUOTE
Eric's absinthe is sui generis. It was superb, but it's not possible to scale his methods from a hundred litres to many thousands of litres

Here we go again.
What do you base this statement on?
Kirk
Sounds like a challenge, a challenge that you are confident will not be met for quite some time, if ever.

But it's still bullxit, sorry.
Donnie Darko
QUOTE(Oxygenee @ Oct 26 2007, 11:19 AM) *

The New Yorker article was a hatchet job on Rodenstock.


Really? He's honest, just uses an alias for fun, and the Jefferson bottle is authentic? No offense intended if he's a friend, and you're obviously far more experienced with vintage beverages than I am, but either the article is promoting fabrications, or Rodenstock is a bit too JMFrancish for comfort.

Giving tastings of and selling more wine belonging to a certain vintage than was produced by the vineyard of that vintage doesn't exactly inspire confidence…
Oxygenee
QUOTE(Kirk @ Oct 26 2007, 06:43 PM) *

Sounds like a challenge, a challenge that you are confident will not be met for quite some time, if ever.

But it's still bullxit, sorry.



Oy vey.

Get plenty of rest, Kirk.
Kirk
I need it, I had a terrible gardening accident and the pain keeps me awake, forgive my pessimism, I don't know what came over my usually bright sunny optimistic self.
Icarus
Here we go again.
(BTW Kirk, I love you man).

Eric proved that it is possible to make a fantastic modern absinthe on a large scale. Sadly enough, how much more it could be scaled up might never be answered.

You'll have to excuse my presumptions, but I assume that the reason it hasn't been repeated is profitability.
As in the past, the majority of Absinthe these days is made for profit. It's a business not a hobby. Remember that.
If cost is no object it is possible to make absinthe that blows your socks off. Unfortunately when you're looking to make money it's not so easy. I think if Oxy and Peter could pump out gallons of absinthe that tasted exactly like PF, and still make money, they'd be all over it.

Although the market is constantly flooded with dozens of new "mediocre" absinthes claiming to be the best, flooding helps increase exposure. It brings not-so-bad absinthe to the common man. It opens doors.

Eventually people's tastes will demand higher quality absinthe, and producers will be forced to explore alternative methods and possibly more costly procedures to meet the demand.
Eventually someone will find the recipe, the procedure, and the backers to produce high volume quality absinthe… and turn a profit.

If you don't like what you can buy, step up. Be the one.
Oxygenee
QUOTE(Icarus @ Oct 28 2007, 08:35 AM) *

Eric proved that it is possible to make a fantastic modern absinthe on a large scale. Sadly enough, how much more it could be scaled up might never be answered.

No he didn't. He proved that, given all necessary asistance and carte blanche by the distillery, he could make an excellent absinthe on a one-off basis in a quantity of around 100 litres. In commercial terms this isn't "large scale" (10 000 litres plus) or even "small scale" (say 1000 litres). It's an experiment.

QUOTE(Icarus @ Oct 28 2007, 08:35 AM) *

You'll have to excuse my presumptions, but I assume that the reason it hasn't been repeated is profitability.

Your assumption is wrong. What is it about Eric's method that you believe is so ruinously expensive? If you think it is more expensive, how much more? 10% more, 15% more, 50% more? Don't you think there is a market for small batch absinthe at almost any price? And do you think that commercial producers are just blind to this? Are you aware that the actual base production cost (herbs, alcohol, alambic heating) of any absinthe is no more than around 10-15% of the price the consumer eventually pays for a bottle? A 15% increase in actual distilling cost would add no more than around 3% to the retail price of a bottle.

QUOTE(Icarus @ Oct 28 2007, 08:35 AM) *

If cost is no object it is possible to make absinthe that blows your socks off. Unfortunately when you're looking to make money it's not so easy. I think if Oxy and Peter could pump out gallons of absinthe that tasted exactly like PF, and still make money, they'd be all over it.

Gallons? As I said, commercial absinthes need to be viable in the 10000 litre plus range. Eric's specific production method isn't viable in this range - for technical, regulatory and practical reasons - which is why it has apparently never been used by any commercial absinthe distiller ever, either now or in the Belle Epoque era. This is why it's called the Texas Rectification method, not the Pontarlier Rectfication method harhar.gif

The cult-like veneration of Eric's one-off batch amongst the HG community is just silly. It was a delicious absinthe, everyone agrees. But to say it was "better" than one of the finer commercial products - Ted's Verte Suisse to take just one example - isn't a fact based judgement, it's an emotional and subjective one. In the same way, to my taste the quality of the best pre-ban absinthes surpasses anything produced today. But I recognise that my judgement is influenced by many subjective "outside the glass" factors - the rarity of the bottles, the fascination of the era, the feeling of living history etc. Judgements on Eric's absinthe are similarly influenced by "outside the glass" factors.

I should add that it's not and never has been Eric himself who makes overblown claims about his method, or about the absinthe he produced in Pontarlier. A handful of accolytes - lets call them the HG Cult for short - have invested the method, the product and and the hobby of HG with a quasi-mystical almost religious dimension, in which Eric is a kind of noble Christ-like figure who has suffered for their redemption. This would be funny, if it wasn't (almost) true.

HGers have two advantages over commercial producers, one undeniable, one more controversial:
1. The ability to do a stalk by stalk, leaf by leaf, flower by flower, herb selection. This simply can't be done when you're dealing with hundreds of kilos, as opposed to hundred of grams.
2. The apparent fact that (most) small tabletop alambics may have characteristics favourable to producing good absinthe not present in (most) commercial stills.

CO producers have two disadvantages relative to HGers (and relative to the distillers of the Belle Epoque)
1. Not all the herbs required can be bought on a large scale at consistently optimum quality. This situation is improving rapidly though.
2. Regulatory restrictions on thujone, and in France on fenchone as well, have real consequences on production. There are some glimmers of light, but for the forseeable future this willl continue to be a constraining factor.

Because it doesn't require cask ageing, and can be made from relatively readily available ingredients, absinthe (like beer, gin and eau de vie, and unlike say wine, whisky or brandy) lends itself to HG production. It'll always attract enthusiasts, and aside from the legal issues, this is worthy activity. I've got the highest respect for many HGers, who've spent years experimenting and developing their skills, and are justly proud of their products.

But the casual vilification and contemptuous language used by some in the HG community to describe commercial producers is just insulting, ignorant, and precludes the possibility of meaningful interaction between the two groups. Please note I said "some" not "all" in the HG community - there are only a handful of people involved in this villification, but they've effectively poisoned the debate for everyone.

To say that all commercial producers are only motivated by money, is just flat wrong. Neither Ted, nor Peter, nor I, nor Helfrich nor several others I could mention have made returns on commercial absinthe that even come close to justifying the time, effort and capital we have expended. More importantly, we didn't and don't expect to. We're involved in absinthe because of a love of, and fascination with, the drink, and the challenge of reinventing something that has been dormant for a century. Sure, we hope to make enough to continue producing it on a large scale, and over time we hope our brands will have some sort of asset value. A few will, most wont. In pure dollar and cents terms this is a fool's business.

Secondly, to say that the high-end commercial producers aren't making the best absinthe they can because of financial considerations is also flat wrong. It's just comical to assume that for a few dollars more CO producers could make great absinthe, but bizarely choose not to.

Thirdly, the assumptions that HGers have expertise not available to the best CO producers, or have devoted more time to research, or have more dedication to experimentation are all insulting and, simply, flat wrong. What is undeniable, is that CO producers have to concern themselves with huge areas of knowledge that are generally irrelevant to HGers - scaling, sustainability and repeatability, regulatory compliance, bottling, packaging, labelling, distribution and sales. These are all as much part of bringing a great absinthe to market as the actual distilling operation (and the same was true in the Belle Epoque).

The effect of the HG Cult, with its claims of moral superiority, and its systematic denigration of those who've staked their livelihood on their love of absinthe, has been to drive commercial producers away from this and other forums. Ted, Peter, Markus and increasingly myself as well post far less here than we used to, because anything we say will essentially be used in evidence against us, endlessly picked over for years to come. I think this is a great pity. The loss of the potential interaction impoverishes us all.
Oxygenee
QUOTE(Kirk @ Oct 27 2007, 07:12 PM) *

I need it, I had a terrible gardening accident and the pain keeps me awake, forgive my pessimism, I don't know what came over my usually bright sunny optimistic self.


Sorry to hear about your accident Kirk.
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