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Conte d'Ugenta
On "what's the best method to get a good louche of L'Italienne" I answered:

this is a good question, cause I'd say the good old slow dripping ice cold water (sometimes I find the best way is to put a plastic water bottle in the freezer, and then wait until it starts to freeze) is the best way, and the ratio, I'd say 1:2-1:3.
The fact is that in spite of that, when I shot the video I dripped water from a carafe with ice, and I completed the louche in some 2:30min. That time I obtained what I call a "good" louche (not an "excellent" one tough), it was fully opaque and as thick as the proto. Funny thing is that after a couple of days I louched another glass of L'Italienne, and this time I dripped ice cold water from a fountain in more than 10 minutes, and guess what? I obtained a louche definitely thinner than the one of the video… What happened? I absolutely don't know. I've not been able to try more times cause I finished the opened bottle I had, and I have only one more closed bottle left I obviously wanna keep closed.
Seeing that some people like Spoon report they are able to obtain a decent louche, and others, like DL, don't, makes me think my case wasn't a coincidence, but I still don't understand why this happens…

I also have to add that while I'll try to increase louche and mouthfeel in the next batch, everyone should understand that L'Italienne won't ever be a thick-louche, creamy absinthe like Jades, cause it's not supposed to be like Jades.
When I started experiments for developing L'Italienne's recipe, I decided to create something different than the classic Pernod/Berger style of Jades, and what I had in my mind as a guideline was Premier Fils, that from what I've heard (I've never had the luck to taste it) was a very feminine, light, very floral absinthe. And I LOVE floral-flavoured stuff!
So I selected and balanced herbs and flowers and eventually obtained what I found a very good feminine, complex and floral absinthe. On the other side, working with flowers is really a pain in the ass, and force you to accept compromises. Let me show you some examples: in the beginning there was a very interesting flower I wanted to use, but when I tried to put it in distillation I realized that the flavour and aroma went completely lost with the distillation. So I tried to put it in coloration, and I discovered that kind of flower was able to completely destroy the absinthe, making it flat and harsh. So I had to discard the idea.
Plus some flowers' aroma is very thin and delicate, and if you put them together with a good amount of anise and fennel (that are strong and oily, they're the absinthe "base") you most likely are gonna lose the floral bouquet. That's why I had to find a perfect balance, and that's why L'Italienne simply cannot be a very thick and creamy absinthe. What I wanna do with the next batch is to keep the improvements I did with this batch and try to obtain the same louche and mouthfeel I got with the proto. Notice that I used exatcly the same amount of anise and fennel, but I suspect the cause of the thinner louche and mouthfeel, and probably even of the slight harshness, is in the coloration. If I'm right I should have no problem to fix it.
A problem that instead I won't be able to fix is the color, cause the yellow hue is caused by a very dark ingredient I use in coloration, and that I can use only in coloration cause it's another plant that lose itself if you put it in distillation. So here's the compromise: I had to decide if discard this plant and have a really green absinthe, or use it and have a yellow-green absinthe. Because the absinthe changed dramatically without that ingredient, I decided to keep it and accept the not completely green colour.

Btw I'm very glad to hear that no one found this L'Italienne too light on wormwood! In my opinion it could be a little more, cause this Italian wormwood get so lovely together with the floral bouquet (as Donnie recognized), and doesn't overstep it. But I think that if everyone find it already enough, I'll keep it unchanged.

That's all for now!

Ciao

Stefano
Wild Bill Turkey
The only sampling I've had so far was graciously provided by Spoon, and I wouldn't have changed a thing!
Steve
QUOTE(Conte d'Ugenta @ Aug 18 2008, 10:50 AM) *
Btw I'm very glad to hear that no one found this L'Italienne too light on wormwood! In my opinion it could be a little more,

I would certainly not object to a bit more wormwood. It is very nice as is, but I would tend to agree with you that it could be a little more, without overwhelming the perfume.
Rimbaud
Conte,

I think it's ridiculous that you have to explain to people how to louche your absinthe properly. This is common sense stuff.

Amateurs!
Doctor Love

Rim the point was that it doesn't seem to always be consistent, I don't think Conte was talking down to anyone.

Absomphe
QUOTE(Spoon @ Aug 18 2008, 01:18 PM) *

I would certainly not object to a bit more wormwood. It is very nice as is, but I would tend to agree with you that it could be a little more, without overwhelming the perfume.


I find that the floral character (which is wonderfully potent) blends so seamlessly with the wormwood, that it seems as if the wormwood character is more assretive than it probably is.

That being said, if that flowery character remains undiminished, I, too, see no reason why a little extra wormwood wouldn't make this marvelous absinthe even better.
Kirk
Wouldn't hurt a bit.
Steve
But then I'm a "wormwood coont™".
Provenance
Who isn't?
Absomphe
What he said.

If it reaches the level of the Mystique, attains a slightly thicker louche, and retains all that floral character, I may just end up habitually snorting it.
Conte d'Ugenta
So for now it's 3-0 for increasing wormwood! Anyway I was thinkin at just a little 10% more, I think it should work…

QUOTE(Absomphe @ Aug 18 2008, 03:28 PM) *


If it reaches the level of the Mystique


Are you referring to wormwood?
Absomphe
Yes, but I don't actually expect it to be quite that wormwood forward.

Even with that perfectly suited Italian varietal, I think it might be a bit too overwhelming for all that floral delicacy.
Donnie Darko
The glass I just poured, with an iced drip from a fountain for 5 minutes, louched pretty well. It was a bit light compared to the creamiest absinthes, but more opaque than my first glass for some reason, even though I made the first glass the same way. I'm drinking it at 4:1 though (30ml absinthe 120ml water), didn't try 2 or 3:1. I don't mind it not having a sledgehammer louche. It's more refreshing and bright than chewy, and the world needs those kinds of absinthes too.

The taste and balance are fantastic though. Premier Fils was what I was thinking of when I tried it, though of course the emphasis of Premier Fils is even more on the alcohol base than the floral character, but yours is closer to something like Premier Fils than Pernod Fils.

I wouldn't mess with the wormwood content at all. What's in there is balanced exactly right, not too strident, and allows the other interesting tastes to have their place on the stage. I wouldn't risk jeopardizing that. You've got great wormwood, it's probably tempting to show it off, but in my book balance is better than showing off individual ingredients. I like that you're bucking what a lot of us conventionally define as ideal absinthe characteristics (sacrificing the typical green color in favor of aroma and taste enhancement, sacrificing the strongest louche in favor of allowing the floral aspect rather than the creamy aspect to lead) in the service of your own vision of what you want an absinthe to taste and smell like.
Doctor Love

I had another glass tonight at a ratio of about 5:2 and it was better in terms of louche, and I like the fuller taste of the perfumey goodness also with less water. Really interesting in terms of it's flavor profile, new for me, but very tasty nonetheless.

hartsmar
Two words - L'Italienne is da bomb!
Nephrite
+1

Stock up…
OCvertDe
Too many others left for me to try still. I will step a glass up to 4:1 though, now that DD has weighed in.
Rimbaud
QUOTE(Doctor Love @ Aug 18 2008, 05:55 PM) *

Rim the point was that it doesn't seem to always be consistent, I don't think Conte was talking down to anyone.


I wasn't criticizing Conte, it was directed at those of you that complain about not getting your L'Italienne to louche properly while the rest of us have no problem doing so.

Steve
QUOTE(hartsmar @ Aug 18 2008, 10:45 PM) *
Two words - L'Italienne is da bomb!

You Swedes count funny.
Doctor Love

QUOTE(Rimbaud @ Aug 19 2008, 08:14 AM) *
I wasn't criticizing Conte, it was directed at those of you that complain about not getting your L'Italienne to louche properly while the rest of us have no problem doing so.


Whatever dude, nobody is complaining. The maker prefaced it himself saying that it didn't always have a strong louche, so I guess you're criticizing him too.
Rimbaud
Nope, love his absinthe. It's fucking sublime. No problem with the louche, either.

You're a wee little complainer, and I'm not the only one here who's sick of hearing it.

Now piss off.
Doctor Love
Actually if you'd PTFA you'd see it was Stompy that kicked off the discussion with a weak louche on his first 8 minute drip, why don't you go ride his ass for awhile.

I never said a cross word about L'Italienne and have nothing but appreciation for Conte's work. If you feel the same way I suggest we not pollute his thread with additional bickering. If you have a problem with me, send me a PM and let's discuss. Otherwise this back and forth is childish BS.

Rimbaud
Absomphe is not the one beating a dead horse.

You continuously pollute this entire forum.

End of story.
Absomphe
Hey, Dr. Glove, PTFA!

QUOTE(Absomphe @ Aug 16 2008, 07:39 PM) *

I find that if the mouthfeel is nice, and the flavor, and aroma are particularly appealing, I'm giving less, and of a fig how pretty, or close to "ideal", the color and louche are.


Sure, I was a little disappointed with the louche, and the color, initially. But once that floral bouquet blossomed, and the louche, and mouthfeel improved noticably after subsequent glasses, I had less than zero complaints about this very artful absinthe.

Like Donnie, I'm very glad to see a maverick approach to absinthe from someone who truly appreciates, and respects the drink, and its history, and who really knows what he's doing.
Doctor Love
Sorry Abs, shouldn't have brought you into this, but I was referring to:

QUOTE(Absomphe @ Aug 15 2008, 06:25 PM) *
I just louched up a glass (about 8 minutes), and unfortunately, it's still quite weak.


I didn't take it as a criticism of this absinthe, nor did I take the discussion that followed to be one either. Conte was looking for feedback and people were providing it.

QUOTE(Rimbaud @ Aug 19 2008, 08:52 AM) *
Absomphe is not the one beating a dead horse.

You continuously pollute this entire forum.

End of story.


Sorry you feel that way Rim. My intention was not to beat a dead horse. I'm ready to drop the subject if you are.
Absomphe
Sounds okay, by me.
Rimbaud
Done.
Provenance
Dear Nice FV People,

I am trying to "loosh my absinthe." So far, I have tried "looshing it" with gin, vodka and tekeela (sp?) with no success. All I have gotten is drunk. Is loosh the foreign word for drunk? If so, I would like like to meet many nice loosh women particularly Bella Pock France as I have heard much good about her.
hartsmar
HA HA HA!
Absomphe
Would that be Bella Pock Marque France?

If so, I think I've already had the displeasure.
Zenzero
Children, children stop the brawl. It's more than obvious that some of you are not (yet) able to participate in a discussion about the complex matters related to a fine, beautiful and delicate drink like for instance, absinthe.
So would those, who this applies to, (no, not me) chill the fuck out, Please.
Personal matters and cockfights can also be settled using PM.
Rimbaud
Does "PM" stand for "personal massage"?
Zenzero
Um…
Wild Bill Turkey
That's exactly what it stands for. After all, for every thread we want…
IPB Image
Rimbaud
Always the puppy licking the face.
Zenzero
That's all that I ever wanted to establish with my reply.



IPB Image

Conte d'Ugenta
… and I'm not in any way offended by Rimmy's post, so end of story, right?

Back on topic, seems like more and more are getting better louches now… Maybe it just needed to breath for a while? And maybe mine last glass didn't louche well just cause it was the bottle-bottom with a lot of sediment (the absinthe in th two bottles I got was taken from the bottom of the barrel, so with ten times the sediment of your bottles)?

Anyway I'm very glad you understood what I meant to do with my absinthe, I feel like I succeded in my goal!

And for the wormwood in the next batch, well now we are 3-1 with Donnie suggesting not to change it. I'll weight carefully what to do, but for sure if I'm gonna increase it I'll add a very little more, cause I don't want to ruin the balance I so painstakingly reached and disappoint you guys that like it!
Doctor Love

I'll drink to that Conte! For my part, I found a little less water than usual did wonders. I definitely look forward to your future offerings. Do you plan on producing other absinthes in the future also, or just L'Italienne for now?

Absomphe
QUOTE(Spoon @ Aug 18 2008, 04:22 PM) *

But then I'm a "wormwood coont™".


The L'Italienne adds a new category of slut to absinthe parlance, and one I'm happy to join the ranks of… the "floral floozy™".
Patlow
Hike up your skirt old man, and I will kick you straight in the bullocks!
Absomphe
You always were an incorrigible romantic.
Conte d'Ugenta
QUOTE(Doctor Love @ Aug 19 2008, 10:49 AM) *

I'll drink to that Conte! For my part, I found a little less water than usual did wonders. I definitely look forward to your future offerings. Do you plan on producing other absinthes in the future also, or just L'Italienne for now?


Now my main concern is L'Italienne, but I keep on experimenting new things and have tons of different prototypes in my cabinet so sooner or later I'll come out with something new for sure! But now it's too early to speak of that…
Zenzero
If it ain't colored with A.a. you'll be safe.
Conte d'Ugenta
QUOTE(Zenzero @ Aug 20 2008, 04:47 AM) *

If it ain't colored with A.a. you'll be safe.


I'd never find any reasonable reason to use A.A. in coloration. It just doesn't make sense.
Rimbaud
Had another glass of L'Italienne last night. No problem with louche whatsoever. Ice cold water dripped from a small carafe over the course of 3 minutes or so.

I have to say, it is the most unique CO absinthe that I have had the pleasure to drink.

Unique in the best sense of the word (I've had a few that were uniquely bad).

Bravo!
Steve
Yes, it's fantastic. I keep appreciating it more and more every time I taste it. The Italian A.a. does make a big difference. I do really still love the prototype with the Pontarlier A.a., but I suppose the Italian wormwood harmonizes better with the more delicate perfumy herbs.
Zenzero
I envy you lucky bastards, while savoring your l'Italienne while I have to
be content with just a Westmalle dubbel and maybe later on, a Duplais balance.

Prosit, salut, slainte and cheers!
Absinthia
Westmalle Dubbel isn't that bad, but compared to a decent absinthe, it is almost Pisswasser. Enjoy! wink.gif
Zenzero
Um, no, that would be more like a Westmalle tripel or a distilled product colored with A.a.
But really, let's not go there again.
Absomphe
If it ain't Westvleteren 12, Rochefort 10, or Stillenacht '96, or the best of that Brett banyard funk, it might as well be Lucid.
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