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The Fée Verte Absinthe Forum - The Oldest, Largest, Most Authoritative Absinthe Forum. > Absinthe & Absinthiana > The Absinthe Library
DennisC
Hi!

I've been looking for a book about absinthe from a sociological point of view. Especially about the prohibition and how the absinthe-drinker was made deviant. I prefer it to be scholarly and from a scientific point of view. I recently read 'Outsiders: Studies in the sociology of deviance' from Howard S Becker who described two deviant groups; mariuhana users and dance musicians, and you can easily draw parallels between the demonization of mariuhana and absinthe. Seeing this forum as an absinthe's experts colloquium I was hoping that someone could advice a book about this subject.

By the way, I came across 'Absinthe: History in a bottle' and 'The book of absinthe: A cultural history', are they any good? Especially 'Absinthe: History in a bottle' seemed like a good book.

Thanks, and excuse me for my incorrect grammar…
Artemis
Conrad's book.
R3al Caravano
Let's assume for a moment that everything that needs to be said that is useful on a subject that is not truly new has already been said. Then one could take a couple of approaches if you were not selling something (BS); you could take a couple of approaches build an approach that is so technical that you confuse the average audience (marketing) or build an approach that will confuse the audience on an understanding of the English Language and logic. I am assuming (in a well justified manner) that the second is not a easily attainable manner. As Americans we have the quick pill for everything (snake oil, where as your opinion of whether it works quintessentially resides in popular opinion [as to whether it is useful or not ] ).

So, my advice is to put in real time, or grab a aforementioned Harvard Pill (given you have the gumption for that).

The thought experts are made in a day or a few or a few years, is that of a fool.
Artemis
Conrad's book.
sixela
He should go to Boveresse so we can hook him up with our 'friend' Arnaud, "ethologue absintheur".
Alan
QUOTE(sixela @ Jun 14 2011, 10:11 AM) *

"ethNologue absintheur".

Other recommended reading? "The Louched Lounge."
Tibro
That may be the case.

But without the "study".
R3al Caravano
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sociology+absinthe+drinker+deviant+
Artemis
He could do that.

And he could come to a whole group of people who did that 15 years ago, and ask for the benefit of their experience.

And getting a rude, obtuse answer, he could write them off as an assholes' colloquium, as opposed to the experts' he had charitably inferred.
R3al Caravano
You're assuming that I'm not an asshole. What evidence or sway or intent of sway would steer you there?
R3al Caravano
It's funny when I click http://lmgtfy.com/?q=conrad+sociology+absi…rinker+deviant+ I get similar results.
R3al Caravano
It seems both answers are equally obtuse. One is obviously obtuse and the other less obvious.
sixela
QUOTE(Alan @ Jun 14 2011, 07:16 PM) *

"ethNologue absintheur".


Nope. Just ask Arnaud for the difference between an ethologist and an ethnologist. I'm sure you'll have an entertaining fête.

Artemis
QUOTE
You're assuming that I'm not an asshole.


No, I'm assuming not everybody here is like you.
QUOTE

And getting a rude, obtuse answer, he could write them off as an assholes' colloquium, as opposed to the experts' he had charitably inferred.

R3al Caravano
Dennis, you can start your study here and now. I apologize for the small sample group.
DennisC
I don't understand your hostility toward people sharing a common interest. I assumed that this was a place for learning and talking about an amazing drink. Reactions like this make people like me go away and without the knowledge that could have been gained we might do some very stupid things, like setting our drink on fire or something….
And of course I've tried google, it didn't give me a satisfying result. Asking people with more knowledge on this subject for a recommendation isn't the same thing as being lazy.

That said, I'd like to thank Artemis for his recommendation. I'll order Conrad's book.
Provenance
QUOTE(DennisC @ Jun 15 2011, 07:18 AM) *
Reactions like this make people like me go away

I'm glad a useful purpose was served.
Artemis
This thread is 16 posts longer than it needed to be.
Provenance
True. But if threads were restricted to informational needs, many would be far shorter while others would not exist at all.
Jaded Prole
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. So to with an honest search for information. Now if some comes in trying to shill crap, asks stupid questions while being unwilling or unable to accept the answers, or insists that misinformation is in fact true and calls people names, then a good flailing is in order. Otherwise, it's good to be helpful and steer the genuinely curious in the right direction.
sixela
QUOTE(DennisC @ Jun 14 2011, 06:02 PM) *

Hi!

I've been looking for a book about absinthe from a sociological point of view. Especially about the prohibition and how the absinthe-drinker was made deviant.


Some sources are also in the Virtual Absinthe Museum:

http://www.oxygenee.com/absinthe/
Donnie Darko
QUOTE(DennisC @ Jun 15 2011, 11:18 AM) *

I don't understand your hostility toward people sharing a common interest. I assumed that this was a place for learning and talking about an amazing drink. Reactions like this make people like me go away and without the knowledge that could have been gained we might do some very stupid things, like setting our drink on fire or something….
And of course I've tried google, it didn't give me a satisfying result. Asking people with more knowledge on this subject for a recommendation isn't the same thing as being lazy.

That said, I'd like to thank Artemis for his recommendation. I'll order Conrad's book.



It's just our way of joking around, don't take personal offense. You came here with an earnest intention, and we respect that, we just respect it in our own informal obnoxious snarky kind of way. Except for Caravano, who is an ass.

Conrad's book is good. It has a few issues, but worth the read and generally informative. That being said, retrospective sociological analysis is a tricky undertaking, especially when the topic under study was primarily described by artists, who have a tendency to embellish. No wonder why absinthe was mistakenly thought to be hallucinogenic. The way Baudelaire described wine, you'd think it was mescaline.
Bruno Rygseck
Hello, Dennis and welcome to the board.

In case you can read Swedish, I advice you not to read that Swedish "book" -- it is mostly some kind of sociological quasi-study, repetitive and badly edited, if at all. Go for Conrad instead.

BR
Provenance
Don't study the sociology of of absinthe. Live it.
G&C
Indeed!™
R3al Caravano
QUOTE(Donnie Darko @ Jun 15 2011, 04:51 PM) *

Except for Caravano, who is an ass.

I'm satisfied with my justly earned credit.
DennisC
QUOTE(Donnie Darko @ Jun 15 2011, 10:51 PM) *
That being said, retrospective sociological analysis is a tricky undertaking, especially when the topic under study was primarily described by artists, who have a tendency to embellish. No wonder why absinthe was mistakenly thought to be hallucinogenic. The way Baudelaire described wine, you'd think it was mescaline.


Good point. I think what I meant was a book that illustrated why absinthe was made illegal and how people reacted to it's prohibition (was there much protest like with the American prohibition of the 20's). It's more of a cultural history I guess.

Thanks for the clarification. I can still see this forum as the experts' colloquium, with the exception of Caravano :)

@Bruno: I can't read Swedish. Gladly in this case… wink.gif
@Sixela: That's a great source. I found it a couple of months ago. Very nice.

I ordered Conrad's book, it should arrive in a couple of weeks.
Donnie Darko
There is also a book called "Absinthe: A Myth always Green", that can be hard to find, but is a great little book and definitely worth having. Artemis handled editing/translation and Peter wrote it with Benoit Noel.
Artemis
You're too kind.

QUOTE
I think what I meant was a book that illustrated why absinthe was made illegal and how people reacted to it's prohibition (was there much protest like with the American prohibition of the 20's)


I seem to remember Conrad's book addresses that in some detail. And yes, there was a lot of protest.

At Oxy's museum site, note in particular Couleru's book - Couleru was right there on the front line of the fight, and on the right side:

http://www.oxygenee.com/absinthe-buy/books4.html




DennisC
QUOTE(Artemis @ Jun 23 2011, 10:23 PM) *

At Oxy's museum site, note in particular Couleru's book - Couleru was right there on the front line of the fight, and on the right side:

http://www.oxygenee.com/absinthe-buy/books4.html


Wow, that looks like a great book. Too bad I can't read French either… It may be a good reason to pick it up though… I don't think there are translations of Couleru's book?
Artemis
I don't think so.

Oxy supplied me with scans of the original some years ago and I was going to do a translation, but it never came to be. It would be a massive undertaking. To thoroughly research absinthe, reading French is a prerequisite.
eric
Another book that I would recommend is "Letters to an absinthe drinker" by Pierre André Delachaux.
It is a fun little book that provides an interesting snapshot of prohibition era Absinthe drinking in the Val de Travers.
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