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The Fée Verte Absinthe Forum - The Oldest, Largest, Most Authoritative Absinthe Forum. > Absinthe & Absinthiana > Vintage Absinthe
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Oxygenee
Just in after a nailbaiting few weeks....part of cache that lay undisturbed for 90 years in a forgotten walled-up section of the cellars of an old hotel...all untouched, all with perfect original seals and excellent levels...
Artemis
It makes me smile.
simon
Nice find!! Are they belonging to you know Oxy? I'm awaiting two bottles from Lyon which i should have in 6 weeks or so. One Deniset and one Fritz duval, which have been located in a similar manner.

I often have wet dreams about discovering big caches :-)
Hiram
Whoa. That's just... beautiful.
Head_prosthesis
Whomp, there it is. af1.gif
Donnie Darko
Jesus H. Christ on a crutch. chickawow.gif

Good thing Betty didn't discover it.
Donnie Darko
You lucky monkey. One to keep and one to sell of everything but the Pernod Fils. If one of those Edouards ends up on eBay I may have to apply for a credit limit increase...
Patlow
question oxy:

on those bottles where the level is a bit lower is this due to evaporation over the years seal or no seal, does some still get out? and if so, does only the water in the absinthe evaporate leaving a higher concentration of alcohol, or does it evaporate together remaining the original solution???
Morrigan
Nice! I do believe I've got wood, and I didn't even think I had that ability...

sleepy.gif
Deluge
Lookin' good!
Absomphe
Absolutely unbelievable...I'm just shaking my head in wonder...

Well, they couldn't be in more deserving hands!

But DAMN, I wish they were MINE!!!!!
Donnie Darko
QUOTE (patlow1040 @ Mar 26 2004, 09:56 AM)
and if so, does only the water in the absinthe evaporate leaving a higher concentration of alcohol, or does it evaporate together remaining the original solution???

The opposite happens. Alcohol evaporates far quicker than water.
Considering it took 100 years for probably 60ml to evaporate, those bottles are sealed quite well.
Patlow
i don't know if that makes sense... take a glass of water and a glass of whatever high proof alcohol you have and let it sit for a week. which goes faster???

do this:

open a bottle of evian, have drink, put the cap back on.

open a bottle of vodka, have a drink, put the cap back on.

wait a week, a month, whatever...

see what i mean???
Artemis
QUOTE
I do believe I've got wood, and I didn't even think I had that ability...


Real absinthe will do that to a girl. Makes the man in the boat come to attention and prepare for boarders.
Donnie Darko
QUOTE (patlow1040 @ Mar 26 2004, 12:39 PM)
i don't know if that makes sense... take a glass of water and a glass of whatever high proof alcohol you have and let it sit for a week. which goes faster???

do this:

open a bottle of evian, have drink, put the cap back on.

open a bottle of vodka, have a drink, put the cap back on.

wait a week, a month, whatever...

see what i mean???

Science doesn't care what may or may not make sense to you:
http://www.iscienceproject.com/labs/finish...ationrates.html

Dems da facts.
Patlow
try my experiment. i guarantee the water goes first.

guaran-fucking-tee!

scientists can be so impractical...
Artemis
I doubt Darko qualifies as a scientist, and neither do I, but here's a fact for you: Absinthe is mixed down to 72% after it comes out of the still BECAUSE it's known that allowing for evaporation, the alcohol content will be only 68% by bottling time. It's pretty obvious if you do the math, that this is not because the water evaporated, unless you're doing Bizarro World math.
Patlow
ok, not arguing the science. but why is it you can have a bottle of stoli on your shelf for A YEAR with no loss evident, and a bottle of evian is waaaay down in a week???

riddle me that batman???
Artemis
It's like when I'm catching fish and you're not. Must be you aren't holding your lips right.
Donnie Darko
QUOTE (patlow1040 @ Mar 26 2004, 01:22 PM)
ok, not arguing the science. but why is it you can have a bottle of stoli on your shelf for A YEAR with no loss evident, and a bottle of evian is waaaay down in a week???

riddle me that batman???

Dammit Jim, I'm a doctor, not a scientist, but perhaps the seals in the Evian bottle and the Stoli bottle are not the same?
verbal_kraze
That's one of the most beautiful things I've ever seen. If only I could have just a taste. just 1/4th of a shot.


Lord Stanley
Patlow, quit arguing and enjoy the beautiful pic of all that vintage.

wink.gif

Alcohol evaporates faster than water. End of story
BlackJack
It gives me a worm-woody...
Lord Stanley
QUOTE (Donnie Darko @ Mar 26 2004, 04:04 PM)
Science doesn't care what may or may not make sense to you:
http://www.iscienceproject.com/labs/finish...ationrates.html

Dems da facts.

"This is because water molecules are held together by hydrogen bonds, which are very strong. Since these bonds are so strong, it takes more energy to break them than it would to break weaker covalent bonds. The only other substance with hydrogen bonds is ethanol, which has an OH group at one end. This single OH group accounts for ethanol having the next slowest evaporation rate."

The conclusions of the experiment are correct but the explanation is a little off.

Water does take a lot of energy to evaporate because of hydrogen bonding but it has nothing to do with covalent bonding in the other liquids. Since evaporation is only a change of state and not a chemical reaction, there's not actually any covalent bonds being broken. Covalent bonds are weaker than ionic bonds but still much stronger than hydrogen bonds. Good thing too. Otherwise, the proteins that make up our bodies would crumble at a quicker rate than a puddle of water evaporates. Ouch.

Does anyone care about this? Probably not but it gives me a rare opportunity to put my chemistry degree to some use.
Patlow
still all you smart-asses can't tell me why water in a bottle evaporates faster than liquor in a bottle...

wacko.gif
verbal_kraze
Maybe cuz the different bottles, orr mayby the green fairy comes and steals some of the water to Louche herself, but doesn't need the alchohol cuz she allready is alchohol
Lord Stanley
QUOTE (verbal_kraze @ Mar 26 2004, 06:28 PM)
...the green fairy comes and steals some of the water to Louche herself...

I louched myself once. It wasn't pretty.

unsure.gif
Hiram
QUOTE (patlow1040 @ Mar 26 2004, 03:24 PM)
still all you smart-asses can't tell me why water in a bottle evaporates faster than liquor in a bottle...

wacko.gif

That's because it doesn't.
rjordan
Damn, that was fooking nice.




gun thug.gif
2loucheltrec
to properly perform your little experiment you would have to have two identical containers and with identical caps to "seal" them. the evian is in plastic with a plastic lid and stoli is in glass with a metal cap... plastic containers because of there porous nature will "breathe" more thus seeming to evaporate quicker than something in a non-porous container such as glass.

duh!!
Patlow
finally an answer! i knew i was wrong and i am a believer in science, but i just wanted someone to tell me why i was wrong. heheheh! waaaaaay too many drinks last night. very av-80.gif of me!
hartsmar
Oxy, that is just beautiful.




ENVY!
kingdubhda
Is that Chartreuse in the picture absinthe? I didn't know that Chartreuse made Absinthe........


Kirk
Actually the drop in proof that Artemis mentioned and the disparity that Patlow observed is possibly due as much to the fact that alcohol loves to absorb water from the air . There fore the volume might not appear to change much while the proof continues to decrease . Leave a glass of vodka out and taste it after 24 hours, even though the volume may not have changed much the proof will have dropped .
Patlow
yeah, i gotcha dude. i was just drunk and felt like arguing a lost cause. but i appreciate everyone telling me how stupid i am. but if you're gonna be dumb you gotta be tough, so i toughed it out.

cheers! AND YES THOSE BOTTLES ARE BEAUTIFUL!!!

i've got my french girlfriend's grandmother (who lives in a small french village on the swiss border) asking around to old families and bars and hotels to see if i can find something.

Oxygenee
QUOTE (kingdubhda @ Mar 27 2004, 08:30 PM)
Is that Chartreuse in the picture absinthe? I didn't know that Chartreuse made Absinthe........

No it's not, and no they didn't. They made Chartreuse.
Artemis
QUOTE
Is that Chartreuse in the picture absinthe? I didn't know that Chartreuse made Absinthe........


Chartreuse is an herbal liquor, but it's not absinthe. The name was trademarked by the monks who made it (Les Peres Chartreux), and they, like the "House of Pernod", were aggressive in filing lawsuits against people who tried to steal their trademark, including Cusenier, whom they sued and against whom they won a judgement. Le Grande Chartreuse was (is?) the main monastery of the order. I'm curious about the "Une Tarragone", though. What's that about?
kingdubhda
Yeah, i know about Chartreuse....I was just wondering if they ever did make absinthe since the bottles were included next to the bottles of absinthe....thus i was confused and thought maybe all of the bottles were absinthe.



Thanks for the Info Oxy and Artemis......

Oxygenee
QUOTE (Artemis @ Mar 27 2004, 10:46 PM)
QUOTE
Is that Chartreuse in the picture absinthe? I didn't know that Chartreuse made Absinthe........


Chartreuse is an herbal liquor, but it's not absinthe. The name was trademarked by the monks who made it (Les Peres Chartreux), and they, like the "House of Pernod", were aggressive in filing lawsuits against people who tried to steal their trademark, including Cusenier, whom they sued and against whom they won a judgement. Le Grande Chartreuse was (is?) the main monastery of the order. I'm curious about the "Une Tarragone", though. What's that about?

In 1903, the Chartreuse monks, following a period of complex political infighting, were expelled from France. The monks in charge of the liqueurs went to Spain and opened a new distillery in Tarragona. In the meantime, the French government had nationalised the brand name and the distillery and sold them to a group of private investors. Since the monks were no longer allowed to call their authentic liqueur "Chartreuse" they decided to call it "Une Tarragone". In France, if one wanted the "real" Chartreuse made by monks and not the vastly inferior imitation, one asked for a "Tarragona". This Tarragona distillery operated until 1989.

In 1921, the monks were able to return to France, and opened a distillery in Marseille, but they were still not allowed to call their liqueur "Chartreuse" so they continued calling it "Tarragona" even though it was now made in France.

In 1929, the monks were finally able to regain the brand name "Chartreuse" and return to their original distillery in Fourvoirie, where they resumed distillation in 1930
Donnie Darko
How does the Tarragone Chartreuse compare with the modern Chartreuse, which I assume is made by the same monks?
traineraz
QUOTE (Hiram @ Mar 26 2004, 05:31 PM)
QUOTE (patlow1040 @ Mar 26 2004, 03:24 PM)
still all you smart-asses can't tell me why water in a bottle evaporates faster than liquor in a bottle...

wacko.gif

That's because it doesn't.

Patlow, why don't you try a REAL experiment . . . put equal amounts of water in both an empty vodka bottle and an empty Evian bottle.

Then put equal amounts of vodka in an empty Evian bottle and an empty vodka bottle.

Observe, and let us know in a month.
hartsmar
QUOTE (Donnie Darko @ Mar 27 2004, 02:17 PM)
How does the Tarragone Chartreuse compare with the modern Chartreuse, which I assume is made by the same monks?

Are you sure about that? Coz that would be some REALLY OLD monks...

harhar.gif
Perruche_verte
"How does the Tarragone Chartreuse compare with the modern Chartreuse, which I assume is made by the same monks?"

And (a harder question to answer, perhaps) how do both compare to the Chartreuse made before the order was expelled from France?

I seem to recall a literary reference or two -- where, I'm damned if I can remember -- to the "old Chartreuse" being revered as something precious and rare.


Oxygenee
QUOTE (Perruche_verte @ Mar 28 2004, 10:09 AM)
"How does the Tarragone Chartreuse compare with the modern Chartreuse, which I assume is made by the same monks?"

And (a harder question to answer, perhaps) how do both compare to the Chartreuse made before the order was expelled from France?

I seem to recall a literary reference or two -- where, I'm damned if I can remember -- to the "old Chartreuse" being revered as something precious and rare.

Vintage Chartreuse is really the only liqueur that is avidly collected and sold at auction in the same way that old wines, cognacs and whiskies are. Unlike most other liqueurs, it seems to mellow and gain interest and complexity in the bottle. The monks used high quality corks, and the survival rate for old bottles is unusally good.

The Tarragona Chartreuse's are close to identical to their 19th century predecessors (which can fetch several $1000's per bottle). The ersatz Chartreuse made by the French government and their nominees while the monks were expelled from France is a very inferior product, and not sought after by collectors today except as a curiosity.

Modern Chartreuse is recognisably similar (especially the VEP versions).
W.Farrell
I seriously got chills looking at those bottles. Just imagine the history, the story behind them ... and someone gets to taste it. Ahh ... so this is what jealousy feels like :)

Thank you for sharing the pictures, they are beautiful.
Artemis
QUOTE
Patlow, why don't you try a REAL experiment


Yes. Steal some car batteries, and pour all the battery acid into a bucket. Throw a hard-boiled egg in there, and stir it around with a big screwdriver. It would be more interesting than the current debate, and twice as useful.
Patlow
i thought this debate ended yesterday??? you cunts are too serious.

but i do apologise for using up vintage absinthe forum space for such a stupid agrument. it started out me being curious, but then it just got dumb...
Head_prosthesis
QUOTE
you cunts are too serious.


I don't think they were being very
serious at all.

And yes your conversation is over.
Artemis
QUOTE
i thought this debate ended yesterday???


There was never a debate. There was ignorance and attempts at education.

QUOTE
you cunts are too serious.


A frequent criticism of the people here who know what they're talking about.

QUOTE
it started out me being curious, but then it just got dumb...


No, it STARTED OUT being about some old bottles of absinthe, and then YOU made it dumb. As is usually the case when that happens here, people then tried to have a little fun with you. And now you've decided to insult them about it.
Patlow
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